South African pilot and adventurer Pierre Carter has been at this game for a very long time, and he hasn’t wasted any time chasing thin air dreams. Pierre has been knocking off the world’s seven summits for nearly 20 years (some of them several times), and has flown off all but Denali (because it’s illegal) and has only Antarcticas Mt Vinson remaining. In between his efforts to summit and fly off the worlds highest peaks (including Carstensz Pyramid in Papua New Guinea) Pierre competed in the Red Bull X-Alps three times, organized the X-Berg hike and fly race in South Africa and most recently had a bit of an epic in Pakistan. Come along for an amazing ride with a very special gentleman.
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Pierre Carr has a passion for paragliding and mountaineering, which has defined his life and career.
Flying off the Seven Summits is a challenging and rewarding adventure that requires permission and careful planning.
The Red Bull X-Alps is a thrilling race that combines paragliding and hiking across the Alps.
Flying off mountains like Kilimanjaro and Denali requires skill, experience, and favorable weather conditions. Flying in the Dolomites can be challenging and requires knowledge of the area.
Food poisoning can have a significant impact on performance in the X-Alps.
Support teams play a crucial role in the success of athletes in the X-Alps.
Knowing the Alps well is essential for navigating the X-Alps effectively.
Knee replacement surgery can improve mobility and allow for continued adventure.
The Red Rocks race and the X-Berg Challenge offer unique and exciting opportunities for paragliding and adventure sports.
Climbing Denali and Carstensz Pyramid are challenging and rewarding mountaineering experiences. Flying in Papua New Guinea can be challenging due to difficult terrain and unpredictable weather conditions.
Obtaining a permit to fly off Mount Everest is a complex process, but it opens up the opportunity for a unique and iconic flight.
Flying off Mount Everest is a surreal and emotional experience, despite the short duration of the flight.
Pierre has future plans to climb and fly off Mount Vincent, as well as other 8,000-meter peaks. Methodical review helps in organizing and understanding the content of a conversation.
Identifying principal themes allows for a more structured and cohesive presentation.
Consolidating subtopics under primary themes provides a comprehensive exploration of the conversation.
Creating fewer, more expansive chapters enhances the listener experience.
Chapters
00:00Introduction and Appreciation
01:48Early Years and Introduction to Paragliding
04:27Career and Seven Summits
06:36Paragliding as an Ascent Tool
10:29Denali and Flying Restrictions
13:05Flying off Kilimanjaro
15:00First Three Summits: Elbrus, Aconcagua, Kilimanjaro
23:00Red Bull X-Alps 2009
29:00Crash Landing and Injury
32:14Flying off Kilimanjaro and Red Bull X-Alps 2011
34:50Adventure in the Dolomites
36:20Falling asleep in the air
37:19Food poisoning in the X-Alps
38:43The role of support teams in the X-Alps
39:36Different strategies in the X-Alps
40:03The challenges of the X-Alps
41:06Goals in the X-Alps
41:34The importance of knowing the Alps
42:38The X-Alps experience of other athletes
43:08The impact of illness on the X-Alps
44:30The recovery process after the X-Alps
45:27Knee replacement surgery
47:09The decision to have knee replacement surgery
48:57The Red Rocks race
49:18The X-Berg Challenge
52:26Climbing Denali
56:40The challenges of Carstensz Pyramid
01:03:26The adventure of Carstensz Pyramid
01:07:54Flying in Papua New Guinea
01:08:54Challenges of flying in Papua New Guinea
01:09:23Flying off Mount Cook
01:10:19Flying off Mount Everest
01:14:10Obtaining a permit to fly off Mount Everest
01:16:13The experience of flying off Mount Everest
Gavin McClurg (00:10.35)
All right, here we go bud. Pierre, I've been meaning to do this with you for a decade, man. I'm finally, I'm glad we were finally able to put this together. It's nice to see your smiling face there, Johannesburg. And it was nice catching up with you before we hit the record button. But welcome to the mayhem and how are you bud?
Pierre (00:31.077)
Yeah, very well Gavin. And yeah, I just want to say thank you for putting the show together for everybody in the Parrot Gliding community. It really is. Your your platform's amazing. So it really gets everyone connected. Yeah. Thanks very much for that.
Gavin McClurg (00:45.282)
Thanks, man. Well, I appreciate that. We were just chatting before we hit record there on.
What should we cover with you? You've been flying for 35 years. There's a lot here. My, you know, my heart of course is with the Red Bull X-Alps and you competed in it in 2009, 11 and 13, so right before I got into it. And so we've got some storytelling to do there, but maybe before, and then we've got your seven summit stuff, which I think is what people are really going to want to hear about. You've got them all done except Vincent, which is.
Pierre (01:02.211)
Yep.
Gavin McClurg (01:20.29)
That's an exciting one to leave to the end. Maybe I can join you on that. How is it? Yeah, I guess getting down there and the whole thing and the ship and the whole deal. Yeah, I sailed around Cape Horn a few years back in the winter, but we never made it across the passage. But yeah, that'll be very interesting. So we'll get into all that. But maybe before we take a walk and fly down memory lane with the X-OPS.
Pierre (01:22.913)
It's the most expensive one, that's why I've left it to the end.
Pierre (01:33.735)
Oh wow.
Gavin McClurg (01:48.258)
catch everybody up on your history a bit. Where did it start? How did it, what was the catalyst? How did you get to where you are today? Because your life has been kind of defined by flying to an extent, right?
Pierre (01:48.927)
Hmm.
Pierre (01:54.921)
Yeah.
Pierre (02:02.085)
Yeah, so I started, I think, started with my climbing, which was, I sort of started when I was in school in the senior years, and got into that in quite a big way in South Africa, so that's rock climbing, not mountaineering, so to speak. And I eventually, I've always had an inkling to fly something, I think it was hang gliders and...
Pierre (02:29.869)
I can't think of the one with the motor on the back. What's the hang glider? The with the motor trike. Thank you. With a trike. I've always I was thinking about that when I was at school trying to get into that sort of thing. And then South Africa had military service back then. I went to do my military service. I came out of that when I was 20 years old and I went off on a climbing expedition with Chris Lomax and David Davies and ADK was in the background as well. He was climbing with his
Gavin McClurg (02:33.591)
Drake.
Pierre (02:58.273)
is an American girlfriend. And David Davies was a big hang glider pilot in South Africa. The Davies brother Hilton and David. And he said, no, there's this new thing paragliding, you must really try it. Andy's got this little rig here. So Andy had sort of started, I think, in South Africa in 87, I guess, but he was a big skydiver and base jumper. So he was jumping
Pierre (03:27.441)
Then David showed me some photographs where he had... I went and climbed a couple of mountains with him, then went off to Machu Picchu, etc. And then met up with David again and he showed me some pictures of Andy sort of plopping off one or two peaks with this... with this sort of rag of his. And I thought, that's the way to go, to climb these mountains because it takes you like six days to climb them and four days to get down. So it goes. I thought that's definitely what I'm going to try when I get back to Joburg.
And so that's where it all began in 88 for me. And I found someone who actually had a hang gliding school in Joburg and they had just bought a paraglider and they were trying to figure it out themselves as well. And yeah, we sort of, she showed me the ropes of whatnot, you know, the school sort of in a hang gliding way there. And I must have been one of the first students, I guess. And yeah, never looked back since then. And then the bug bit were literally in my climbing, took a dive and you know.
Paragliding came to the forefront, yeah, to go, but I've always been climbing and I have linked it up with a bit of my mountaineering, hence the seven summits.
Gavin McClurg (04:28.699)
Took over.
Pierre (04:38.889)
And yeah, it's been a good ride. But it's always been something as a career. I never really had a proper career. Like most people get it. I've always worked to go and fly or go and climb something. So, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (04:52.61)
How do you usually, what kind of work does that typically entail?
Pierre (04:56.929)
I'm a builder, so I've always been a builder. So I did a building degree and I tried the big corporate companies. I lasted maybe four years and that was it. And then I just, you know, I've pretty much been by myself jumping from small little companies to small little companies and building up enough cash to go into a mountain or and then I decided, you know, with the seven summits and I'd save up enough cash over two years and then go and do one of the summits.
Gavin McClurg (04:59.522)
Okay.
Pierre (05:24.297)
And so it's been going on since 2005, my seventh summit. This is a bit, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (05:29.686)
Really? So that started before your X-Alps campaigns. It's quite cool to hear that... Go ahead.
Pierre (05:34.141)
Yeah, I'd actually... I wanted to start in 1990. I came up with the idea in 1998, 1999. Pretty much the same time as Zeben Claire did actually. And they got sponsorship and just did it in like two years or two and a half years. And I tried to get sponsorship, but South Africa is a bit of a... They've got other problems to worry about. So, yeah, I've just been hammering away at it and I just thought let me just go for it and...
Gavin McClurg (05:57.506)
Right.
Pierre (06:02.793)
save up the money and just go and tick it off as I go along and enjoy the ride.
Gavin McClurg (06:07.806)
It's very cool to hear that you and Andy came out of the climbing scene back in the day and used paragliders as they were kind of first designed, which was a descent tool for mountaineers. And then now, 35 years later, you guys go and do an expedition together in Pakistan, and you're using them as an ascent tool. We just did this show with Jake Holland and
Pierre (06:33.602)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (06:36.974)
And, you know, he's been doing these crazy trips with Fabby Buell and, and Will Sim and these, you know, really famous climbers who have gotten into paragliding and gotten really good because they just want to avoid the, you know, the tracks. They want to avoid the five, 10 days getting in. And it's very cool to see it kind of come full circle with you. I mean, and it's also very cool to see you guys, you know, you're still friends, you're still doing it, still chasing it.
Pierre (06:51.389)
The high cup. Yes, yes, yes. Yeah, I was with, yeah.
Pierre (07:03.021)
Yeah, yeah. We're nearing 60 now, both of myself and Andy, so another year and a half we'll both be 60. I think we're the same age. So yeah, but yeah, I met Jake, well obviously in Pakistan when we were there this last season, and I met him, he's filming for Aresha and Tom, and so we, and I was helping him out with all the winching and stuff and sort of the background stuff, but it was great. Yeah, they're great, great guys.
Gavin McClurg (07:24.702)
Yeah, I'm killing it.
Pierre (07:32.393)
Jake told me about some of those trips of his. It's quite amazing, what he's been doing. Yeah. Hmm. Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (07:36.79)
Pretty wild. The footage is just unbelievable. It's very, very inspiring, very tempting. You've been off Kili six times, you were saying, before we started here. That's impressive.
Pierre (07:48.517)
Yeah, so part of the, to get out, when I started the Seven Summits, I thought, okay, I'm just gonna be a cowboy and go and do it. And then I saw people who had done it in the past got slapped on the wrist, got put into sort of a jail for a couple of days, and then got paid a big fine to get out. And I thought, no, actually I don't feel like doing that. So I'd rather go spend a couple of days in some dodgy jail in Africa or wherever it might be. So I thought, let me try and do it all legally.
and to get permission to fly off some of these seven summits did like Denali, they actually won't let you. So I've tried Denali, it's actually, I've climbed it but I haven't flown off it, even though I say I've flown all the seven summits. Denali still alludes me because they won't let me, they won't let us climb, actually. When I went there in 2000 and, when was it, 15 I think, or 16, they actually, they must have Googled me because as soon as I got there, they go and get my permit, they said, come into the boardroom.
sign this big lawyers letter, you're not going to fly, give us your glider and then we'll give you your permit. So I had to hand all the kit over and they took it all and said come get it when you come down the mountain. So it was...
Gavin McClurg (08:59.042)
That is really interesting to me. We had a different experience with Denali. So when we did the Alaska Range Traverse, we really wanted to start in Lake Clark National Park because it's truly the end of the Alaskan Range. I mean, you only have to be 20 kilometers into it and it's the start of the Alaskan Range. And they were just flat out, no way, not gonna happen. But Denali was...
Pierre (09:21.16)
Yeah.
Pierre (09:26.749)
but they'd let you land in the park. See, they'd let me take off somewhere else and land in the park is no problem, but taking off in the park, they said not a chance. So it was, yeah, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (09:35.59)
You're right. Yeah, you're right. You're right. That was, that's the same, that's the same we got. I mean, we, I brought some films in to show them and we went, you know, I went out months before because I knew that was going to be the make or break thing. So I went out months before and went to the ranger station there for the Denali, you know, it's on the south side, but it's, we went and sat down with them and they were just fascinated and, and their take was that, Hey, we can't treat you any differently than we do a helicopter or a plane. You know, you, you can take, you know, cause we explained it.
Pierre (09:47.29)
Yeah, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (10:04.65)
We could take off from here. It was Heart Mountain. It's right outside the park. And on a good day, we'll fly the whole thing. I had no idea actually if we could actually do that, because I hadn't flown up there. But it seemed reasonable. But it required, it was over 100K. And I said, but there's a good chance we're not going to make it. So what happens then? And they said, well, you just have to declare an emergency landing. We want to see your trackers. We want to be able to follow you guys.
Pierre (10:06.863)
Yeah.
Pierre (10:12.835)
Yeah, yeah.
Pierre (10:18.47)
Yeah, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (10:29.378)
and you have to declare in the air an emergency landing, just like you would if you were flying a plane, and then land, but then you can't relaunch. That's it, so you're right. Okay, yeah. Ah, shoot.
Pierre (10:34.419)
Yeah.
Yeah, OK. Yeah. So it was so it was very it was very tempting and it still is tempting to. I guess you could always sneak, give them an old glider to confiscate and take your little life on and bomb off. But there's only one road out, which is a bit of a problem. I'm sure they would stop you before you made it out. If you had someone waiting at the bottom with a car and you jumped in the car and you bolted, but it's a long road out. So, yeah. That's it. It's a long glide. Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (10:54.838)
Hmm. It's a long glide. Yeah, it's a long, long glide. You'd be very visible for a while. You'd have to do it in a very cloudy day or something. Just disappear into the clouds.
Pierre (11:07.566)
Yes, yeah. And it's beautiful, I mean...
Pierre (11:13.633)
I mean we were up there and it was a balmy day where we were in our short sleeve shirts I think. We didn't even have a down jacket on. And it was 15 km up yeah 15 km from the nice sort of north I think it was North Lee Wind. It was beautiful I mean it was perfect launchable day but anyway that's the way the cookie crumbles. So Zeb and Claire were the last to fly off. Yeah and I don't think anyone else.
Gavin McClurg (11:20.535)
Oh, that's amazing, because Denali's always the coldest.
Gavin McClurg (11:34.82)
Yeah, right. Ah, shoot.
Gavin McClurg (11:41.142)
They did fly off it.
Pierre (11:42.501)
Yeah, they did. Yeah. And ever since then, they've no, they I think they just said the Rangers just said that's it, no more. And that is that's when the big rule came in. No paragliding in the park. Yeah. So, yeah. So I think they got slapped on the wrist and
Gavin McClurg (11:44.062)
and they got caught or what happened.
Gavin McClurg (11:57.102)
Yeah, it'd be nice to, I mean, it'd be nice to, you know, Will Gadd's been pretty successful at lobbying the Canadian government to then they're slowly changing these rules in the Canadian parks. I think he's opened up two or three now. And, you know, it's just this ancient rule of the 60s with the Wilderness Act and, you know, and how we're classified as aircraft. And it'd be, it'd be really quite nice to have that rule change. Not going to happen tomorrow, but maybe someday.
Pierre (12:08.973)
Yes, yeah. Okay.
Pierre (12:15.474)
Yeah, yeah.
Pierre (12:23.697)
Yeah, that is weird. So as I was saying, we sort of, I decided to do the legal route. So I've gone to each mountain of a person, only two really difficult mountains was Kilimanjaro to get permission to fly off that. And Everest, those two didn't allow it. And we lobbied. So my friend Linda, who does the paragliding Kilimanjaro tours, and I helped out in that, she lobbied for, it must have been about eight years.
of just knocking on the doors and just going to see the government and the various ministers and eventually they said okay we'll allow you and that was 2011. That night or so we went to the Kili then and three of us flew off and yeah. That's if you don't thermal once you get below cloud base you can then obviously thermal back up to cloud base but if this is the straight glide down back to the hotel is about anything from 50 minutes to an hour 10. Just gliding.
Gavin McClurg (13:05.25)
Huh. How long is that glide? How long are you in the air? You know...
Gavin McClurg (13:23.01)
Jeez, that's amazing. Wow. What's the start and end?
Pierre (13:23.029)
you just go and go and go. But it is beautiful. So you roughly got 5500 meters of, I think it's the highest top to bottom sort of, foofy if you want to call it. So it's yeah, it is beautiful. The last person I took off she was 65, I think just over 65 and her husband
Gavin McClurg (13:39.613)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (13:43.306)
Yeah, so it's...
Pierre (13:54.801)
Her brother-in-law flew off single and... No, it was her husband. He flew off by himself and I took her. She must have been in her mid-60s. And literally after five minutes she fell asleep. She was just so tired, I think, and ultimately got to... And she fell the whole ride down. Her husband was a bit pissed off with her, I'm sure. And I had to wake her up before we landed.
Gavin McClurg (14:10.802)
Right. Did you sleep? Ah! Hey, wake up. You should probably be watching this. That's really funny. Denali's gotta be close to that, isn't it? What's Denali? 23? Is Denali 23? Cause I mean, if you went off that, I mean, that's almost six. If you went off that, you'd be landing at basically sea level. You know?
Pierre (14:27.566)
It must be very close to that, yeah.
Pierre (14:37.005)
Yeah, yeah, because you land at Moshi there, and Moshi I think is around about 500 meters above sea level. So it's, yeah, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (14:43.482)
Yeah, huh? Oh, I hope you get to do it. Well, hey, maybe then, I wasn't planning this, but maybe an interesting way to do this is by timeline. Let's go, you started your first in 2005. Let's just do through the seven summits, but then interrupted, of course, by your EPSALPS campaigns. Let's do that. So 2005 was the first one.
Pierre (15:00.693)
Okay yeah that's a good idea yeah okay. So that was the first one Ulbrus and that I just did by myself and I actually got some mates who wanted to go and climb it and yeah I just said well I'm gonna come with you guys and I'll fly off it and yeah that's it was pretty straightforward nice easy climb nothing but Russia I really loved Russia it was a fantastic country I mean the people are just so
Gavin McClurg (15:26.727)
Yeah.
Pierre (15:30.877)
They're very much like South Africans, actually. I think the country's been through a big turmoil in terms of their change. And so we and we sort of I found our gel with him very, very well. We had great parties. It was really fantastic. Even though we couldn't speak a word of each other's languages, it was still good. And yes, yeah, that's they definitely can drink. That's one thing. Well, that's.
Gavin McClurg (15:42.658)
Oh, interesting.
Oh.
Gavin McClurg (15:49.358)
Right. Bound by vodka.
Gavin McClurg (15:57.)
Hahaha
You know, it seems like places that are dark a lot of the year, Booze tends to help.
Pierre (16:07.714)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (16:09.829)
Hehe
Pierre (16:10.697)
I'd agree with that, but the Russians they do, yeah, anyway, I really enjoyed them. So I don't know why they're fighting this bloody war. But anyway, that's Putin's problem. But yeah, lovely, lovely people. And then that was 2005. And in 2007, I went and did ACK. Actually, 2006, I went and did... No, wait, let me start this again. No, I started 2003, I went and did ACK with my wife. And I wanted to fly off and...
Gavin McClurg (16:15.575)
Mm.
Mm.
Gavin McClurg (16:34.67)
Ah!
Pierre (16:38.617)
We climbed it, but we got up very late and she wasn't going to go tandem with me. I had my own little rig, my little Montana that I was a gradient pilot in those days. So I had a Montana that Andre had made for me and we were up there at like I think half past seven, eight o'clock at night. The sun goes down around about half past nine and I didn't want to let my wife walk down by herself.
Actually in her story, her version is she would have put a pickaxe in my head if I had, but if I had left her there. So anyway, I walked back down with her and we got back to camp sort of at 11. We did the Polish Direct, which is a bit of an ice climb at the top. So we didn't do the normal route and we went down the normal route. So that was the first time I went to try and fly off it. And then 2005 I did Ilbrus and then...
2007 I went back to do acro kagyo with a friend of mine, Guy Pittman. And he had just learnt how to fly. I think it was his, right about his 20th flight. And so he was, he was just saying, yeah, I'm in your hands. You just tell me if, when to run, when to not do, what to do. And I said, okay, that's cool. It should be fine. If the weather is, I found generally if the weather, if you can, you want to climb a mountain in good weather and if you get on top,
Gavin McClurg (17:42.85)
Jeez.
Pierre (18:00.261)
and it's all good. The weather generally is going to stay fine. And it's been like that pretty much of all my flights off the big mountains. You're generally summiting good weather and you're going to have good flying weather then as well. Unless you're pushing the boat out and going up in terrible weather. But so we got up top and there was zero wind and we got up there quite early. We did the normal route and I think we're up top at like 12 o'clock.
Gavin McClurg (18:07.701)
Mm.
Pierre (18:29.421)
one o'clock in the day. But there was no wind on top, there was absolutely no wind. And I must have tried 30 times to run off and you just can't run fast enough, you need skis or something to be able to go off. And I can't, the air is so thin. And it's big on top there, it's like the size of a rugby field. You've got plenty of running space, but we just couldn't get it launched.
Gavin McClurg (18:42.881)
Oh wow, because the air is so thin. Shit.
Gavin McClurg (18:52.59)
It's not technical. This is a class zero launch. It's not hard.
Pierre (18:56.425)
Yeah, well, you're running off a cliff, but you're just running like on a big, you know, it's this flat and you just run off the edge. So, yeah. So, yeah, it's a guy tried about probably 15 times and he said, that's it. I'm buggered. Yeah, we didn't have oxygen or anything like that. We just acclimatized. And he said he's walking down. So I said, cool, I'm going to carry on until sunset and then I'm going to walk down if I don't get off. And I must have tried 40 times or so. Eventually.
Gavin McClurg (18:58.499)
Oh.
Gavin McClurg (19:02.93)
Okay.
Gavin McClurg (19:24.617)
Oh my God.
Pierre (19:25.957)
Eventually the sun, I mean, you still buggered after running 20 meters that you just, you have to rest for like half an hour, then you try again and rest. And at sunset, the sort of, must be the east, sorry, the west face, was sort of heating up and just a little puff of air was coming up the cliff face. And I just put a streamer out on the cliff. And as I saw it moving, I just ran and...
Gavin McClurg (19:40.557)
Yeah.
Pierre (19:51.305)
That little puff of air just caught the glider nicely. As I got to the edge, she felt nice and solid and not like I was gonna have to jump up and deal with the rag. And so she didn't lift me up, I saw it was quite a dive. She really did dive right into it. And yeah, so that's how. And then I went and landed back at our base, at least a high camp at 6,000 meters. And beat Guy down actually, he is still walking down.
Gavin McClurg (20:07.112)
Mm.
Gavin McClurg (20:19.65)
Ah, did you have, and you had enough light you could see?
Pierre (20:20.341)
That's all I was...
Yes, I sort of took off probably at, I guess it must have been about half past seven and the sun goes down at about nine. So, yeah, yeah. I actually flew around. It was nice. I flew around and I stayed up for about 20 minutes or so. Didn't get a bath though. That was December. I remember we had Christmas up top there. So, yeah, it must have been 28. It was just after December that we...
Gavin McClurg (20:29.531)
Oh, OK. You had enough time. What time of year was that?
Gavin McClurg (20:37.525)
What time of year was that?
Gavin McClurg (20:46.882)
God, there wasn't more, I don't, why wasn't there more, I would think it'd be rowdy and thermal, thermally up there in the middle of the day.
Pierre (20:54.39)
It was strange, it was very nice and calm. The next day though, we then radioed down to a... Because we were doing everything by ourselves, we weren't doing it through a company. And we radioed down and said, how much for you guys to come and collect all our gear? And they said, whatever, it was a thousand dollars or something. So we said, cool, we're going to leave it up here. Mark, we told them we were going to leave it. And they came and collected the gear and Guy and I then flew off from 6000 meters.
Gavin McClurg (20:57.431)
Wow.
Pierre (21:19.645)
Now remember this is guys like 20th or 25th flight. And we took off and we flew over, I can't remember the name of the valley there now. Anyway, we flew up, flew off and we just hit this beautiful thermal going up. Nice and huge, I mean it was huge thermal. So for a beginner it was just so easy. He just had to do gentle circles, no tight course or anything like that. And it took us back up to 6,000, sorry, 7,600 and something meters.
Gavin McClurg (21:48.808)
Whoa!
Pierre (21:49.026)
We were right above Aconcagua and it was beautiful. It was unbelievable. Yeah. So I think that was the first time someone had actually ever flown above Aconcagua.
Gavin McClurg (21:51.339)
Whoa.
Gavin McClurg (21:59.146)
Wow! Amazing!
Pierre (22:00.549)
And then we flew around and we told the guys we'd come collect our gear at base camp, but we should have told them we'd collected out, in the, back at the, on the road at the hotel. Cause we could have flown all the way back, you know, like, like Anton did from the pass. But, but it was beautiful. I mean, it was unbelievable and bloody cold. But yeah, and then we went and after sort of flying around for an hour, eventually we were freezing and we went and landed at base camp. But yeah, it was.
Gavin McClurg (22:15.21)
Wow. Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (22:28.078)
Working.
Pierre (22:29.353)
That must have been one of the most memorable flights of my seven summits. Just that and doing it with someone, a good mate of mine who had just learned how to fly. I mean, it was unbelievable. Yeah, and really fantastic conditions. 2007, if my memory serves me correct. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Very, very lucky we're climatized. So it was, you know, we didn't have to worry about oxygen and all that sort of stuff. It was great. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then.
Gavin McClurg (22:35.074)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (22:41.877)
That was 2007 you said?
Gavin McClurg (22:47.934)
All right. Wow, that was special. Amazing. OK, so you've taken.
Gavin McClurg (22:56.318)
Yeah. OK, so you've ticked off three, right there, egg? Yeah.
Pierre (23:00.277)
So we took off Aconcagua. I subsequently went back and flown off Aconcagua in 2007-2008. I did nothing. 2009 I decided to try Red Bull X-Helps. So that then sort of I said okay let me sort of go into a mountain let me go and do an X-Helps. It cost me I think the first one cost me probably 60,000 rand which is roughly three and a half thousand dollars in today's terms.
Gavin McClurg (23:27.778)
Mm. Yep.
Pierre (23:30.337)
and so I thought okay let me save up for that and go and do that. It just sounds like I just love the adventure and I've been watching because I think it started in 2003 or the first one if I remember correctly. So I sort of watched it twice and thought okay now I'm gonna go and do this enter this and see what's yeah just apply and see if they'll accept me. So they did and yeah that was great fun. So began sort of six years of doing XLBs.
Gavin McClurg (23:39.474)
Yep.
Gavin McClurg (23:58.318)
Yeah, right. So, so what I've asked the others with this, and I'd love to do the same with you, is, you know, rewind back to 2009. I think that was the one. Kregel's first one, yeah, Tomo, I think was second and Hansa was third, I believe. It was, as I remember, that was pretty bad weather year, wasn't it?
Pierre (24:08.925)
So that was Kriegel's first race. Yeah.
Pierre (24:20.128)
Um, yeah, hell, every race I've done has always been bad weather.
Gavin McClurg (24:25.824)
I remember 2011 was shockingly bad, but I think, I'm pretty sure 2009 was pretty tough.
Pierre (24:34.821)
I got eliminated early, I ended up breaking my foot and having a bad... basically I crashed into the mountain and I'll tell you about that now anyway. So that was 2009 I went and decided to do... sorry 2009 was my first X-Alps. And for me it was just, you know what the X-Alps is a huge adventure. And in those days we didn't have the cell phones where...
I don't think they had Google Maps on cell phones. And I can't remember, because I've still got them. I've got this box of maps across the Alps, there are 150,000 that would track ourselves and work out how to go and coming from some South Africa not knowing the Alps very well. You know, I've been to climb the mountain here or there, but I didn't know the valley systems. And I've flown some competitions there, but I didn't know the valley systems. You have to live in the Alps, I think, for a good five, six years and fly there to get to know those valleys well and how everything works.
So for us and my friend James, who's Braid, he was the gradient person in South Africa, the gradient dealer here, he put me in contact with Andre and Andre helped out with gliders and whatnot. And he is fantastic that way. And Tom was also a gradient pilot then and a couple of other gradient pilots as well. And yeah, that was a great adventure.
I think I got eliminated. I was probably the second or third to get eliminated. And I basically, where were we? We were flying around the Grosse, yeah, the Grosse glockner, I think was the turn point, somewhere out down there. And I was thermaling, come over the pass, and we're thermaling on the southerly side there going up. And I just, I fell out the back of the thermal, but I was very close to the terrain. And I basically...
Gavin McClurg (26:13.346)
Yeah.
Pierre (26:27.977)
came around and I just, I'm not going to make it. And I just smacked straight into this huge granite face. And it was a good, probably, I guess, 45 to 50 degree angle. So, you know, I ended up, I hit it hard and I sort of tumbled and, luckily my glider got caught in some little bush. And then I was just lying there on this granite thinking, geez, that was stupid, but luckily nothing's broken. Everything seems okay. And then I look around and I said, geez, but where are my shoes?
Gavin McClurg (26:33.728)
Oh
Pierre (26:56.885)
couldn't find my shoes. Both shoes were gone and I was looking for them. I said, what the hell? And then I saw my foot was cut and bleeding quite badly. I said, well, you know, the adrenaline is there so you kind of don't feel much. And I then found my shoes, both my tackies, my running shoes were up around my knees. And my feet from hitting the granite, my feet had punched through the front of my shoes. And in so doing so, my, obviously the...
Gavin McClurg (27:20.11)
Oh.
Pierre (27:26.205)
the shoe, the webbing or whatever of the shoe had cut into my one, my right foot, which hit the ground first, I think, took the hardest, the brunt of it. It cut right down to the bone on my toes. So my two, my big toe and my toe next to it were right down to the bone, and there was blood, and my shoes had been pushed right up onto my knees. It was quite weird. So I radioed James, and I said, James, call the doctor, I'm gonna take off again.
Gavin McClurg (27:37.401)
Oh god.
Gavin McClurg (27:41.718)
Ah!
Gavin McClurg (27:49.229)
Oh man.
Pierre (27:56.229)
and fly as far as I can before this adrenaline runs out and I won't be able to walk. So I put my shoes back on, took some duct tape and wrapped them on so they wouldn't come because the front of them was totally, they were just flapping open. And yeah, then moved across off onto sort of 100 meters down onto sort of more where the grass is a little bit flatter or the snow, should I say. And relaunched and just flew straight down the valley as far as I could.
By the time I got there, James had organised, the team doctor was there from Red Bull. He stitched my toes up and he gave me an injection that just numbed my legs from the knee down. So I couldn't feel my legs from the knee down. I thought, okay, I can carry on. So I carried on for another day or two and he settled where off in about 10 hours time. And then he's not giving me another one.
Gavin McClurg (28:39.539)
Wow.
Gavin McClurg (28:45.233)
Get out of here.
Pierre (28:54.845)
So I basically started running again because I couldn't feel anything.
Gavin McClurg (28:58.454)
Oh god, dude.
Pierre (29:00.641)
And yeah, it was eventually, obviously the pain came back sort of the next day. And then I carried on limping around for another about half a day. And then I just said, no, this is just too sore. And I basically called it. But yeah, that was a good adventure. That was my first taste of Red Bull. I think I was in probably day three then or day two. I can't remember. I think it must have been day two at the course. Yeah, yeah, it was really early on. So I lasted to day three or day four. And then I just said, no, that's it. I'm out. And I basically.
Gavin McClurg (29:13.171)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (29:21.414)
Also, it's pretty early on.
Pierre (29:29.805)
I actually waited for another guy to come past me before I declared my... You know, yeah, yeah. So... But that was it. I loved it and I thought that's it. I'm coming back to the next one. So, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (29:33.926)
Yeah, as you should, as you should. It's the unwritten rule, the honor rule.
Gavin McClurg (29:45.155)
Wicked. Cool. So that wasn't enough to put you off crashing into the mountain, wrapping your shoes around your knees. This is proper South African. I love it. Okay. So did you do any seven summits between nine and 11?
Pierre (29:50.737)
No, no, no.
Pierre (29:56.041)
But, uh...
Pierre (30:00.097)
Yeah, then 2010 I think it was we did the Kelly. We got permission to do Kelly. It was either 2010 or 2011, no it must have been 2010 September, that I got permission to go and do it and we put a big team together. There was about 10 of us that were going to fly off.
of Kili and we decided to go in September, October is when the sort of the doldrums hit that part of the world from a sailing point of view and hopefully we said hopefully it'll transfer onto land as well and there won't be too much wind because a lot of people have a lot of bad wind up in Kili when they try to take off. A big Australian crowd was trying to do it at the same time but they were trying to fly off like a hundred people at a time, can't remember the guy's name.
Gavin McClurg (30:28.503)
Mm.
Pierre (30:48.297)
They weren't very successful. Babu, I think, went with them and flew off in 2000. It must have been 2013 or no, he flew off Everest in 2013. Anyway, Babu did it after about a year or two after we had done it. And he did it in the howling wind. Yeah, it's very, very risky. Anyway, so we did that. And out of the 10 of us or 11 of us that were going to fly, only three of us managed to fly off. So the wind wasn't...
nice and gentle like we'd hoped. It was actually coming over the back, so coming from the crater over the back at about probably five to ten kilometers an hour and to try and do it, yeah. And we thought maybe we should launch into the crater and hopefully get a little thermal and go up and over. So we waited around to do that and eventually the sun started warming up the east side and nice strong thermals were coming through.
at a good 5-6 kms a meter a second. Really nice big gusts. So we thought, well, let's just take off into one of these gusts and to push the tailwind out the way and we'll take off. And that's exactly what we did. But the three of us who have experienced the others, we've all been flying for maybe three or four years at that stage, and they just said, not a chance. They're not going to do this. It's just the risk seemed too high. But it was beautiful. So I took off in a tandem.
Gavin McClurg (32:06.844)
200.
Pierre (32:14.965)
a friend of mine who's busy 2010 I decided to try and do the seven summits with a friend of mine Marianne Schwankart who's a famous South African climber and she's a photographer and videographer and everything so I said well you come along we'll go tandem and you can film everything and we can make a little movie at the end of the day you know so she's done a couple of them with me except
because it's just too expensive for both of us to go. And she won't come and do Vincent. That's also, that's more expensive than Everest nowadays. But yeah, so I've got a lot of footage that eventually when I get the time, we're gonna go through it and edit it ourselves sometime. But yeah, so anyway, so yeah, that was the killy. And then in 2011, the next XL came up and obviously you start training, yeah, the year before you start in November, you start your training. I'm sure you know how it all works and yeah.
Gavin McClurg (32:50.04)
Mm.
Gavin McClurg (32:56.566)
We'll have to.
Gavin McClurg (33:09.419)
Yep.
Yeah.
Pierre (33:13.817)
and you train like hell and get fit. And yeah, 2011 was a good year, sorry.
Gavin McClurg (33:20.807)
And no, I was just going to say just to remind the folks with the course in 2011 was, I believe Toma was second, right? And that one, was that? It kind of ran the whole way.
Pierre (33:29.853)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Running man. I think he came second. Yeah, he can run that man. It's amazing.
Gavin McClurg (33:35.618)
Yeah, can't outrun that man. Yeah, and really bad weather. I mean, we always say, yeah, it's really bad weather, but 2011 was shocking. I think that was Paul Guschelbauer's first. He did quite well. Yeah, it was a good year to be really fast on the ground.
Pierre (33:46.345)
I remember there was a lot of rain.
Pierre (33:52.321)
Yeah, so it was a good year. It was turning out to be probably my would have been my best year. And I did the first couple of days with Honza. I think four or five days I was with him and we're cruising along nicely. We were sort of in between fourth and seventh place and we're a nice pair flying together when we did fly and going through the night etc. But we got sick. We ate something in one of the high altitude little...
I think we got there just before the bell went at 11 o'clock. Oh yes, in 2009, that was the last 24 hour non-stop one. That was my, yeah. Then 2011, they introduced, you had to stop for four hours. I think it's longer now, I think it's six hours now, or five hours, I can't remember. But we just made it to the hut.
Gavin McClurg (34:28.717)
Mmm.
Gavin McClurg (34:35.307)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (34:39.678)
Yeah, now they have this last one, they have that adjusting rest now. It's the long, I think it's maybe seven hours, but you can decide when you wanna take it. It's quite an interesting, it's something Kriegel's been pushing for a long time because he's really felt like the lack of sleep is super dangerous. So it was quite cool artwork.
Pierre (34:47.102)
Wow, okay.
Okay, oh, okay, yeah.
Yeah, yeah, no, it is because 2011 I fell asleep thermally. We took off at, anyway, let me go back. We got, we ate something, we just got into the hut at 11 o'clock and the lady had some soup left, the dregs of the bowl kind of thing and we, she gave us that and we ate that. Next morning we both took off again and carried on, onto I think the Tres Amir was the
Pierre (35:28.421)
in the Dolomite. Yeah, so we got there and I started feeling sick during the day. And I think Konzer, we separated in a flight and I only saw him again at the turn point, actually. And he was sweating. I just remember he was just like this. He was drenched. And it wasn't from the walk up. It was this he was just dying. And I thought, hey, my stomach. And I've really thrown up once in the morning. I wonder if we picked up the same thing.
Gavin McClurg (35:48.24)
Ugh.
Pierre (35:54.373)
Anyway, he went and got to the turn point and went off to fly somewhere. I still was going to the turn point because I had stopped and had something to eat. But I had a really queasy stomach. And I took off and clearly my mind wasn't with it because I hadn't my speed bar wasn't done up and I hadn't done my pod properly. So it was one of those, oh, God, anyway, let me just get a thermal and go up and try and fly as far as I can. And I was up above the actual Tresemeres, the three Tresemeres themselves.
and it's going up really nicely, so it's getting to three, three and a half going, carrying on. And the next minute I woke up, I don't remember, like 15 minutes of it, and I'd actually fallen asleep and my glider just gone in whatever direction I'd fallen asleep in. And it was quite scary. You suddenly, shit, OK, I don't think. And then you think, OK, I'm not. Yeah. And then I realized, yeah, it's not because of lack of sleep. I must obviously be quite sick.
Gavin McClurg (36:39.682)
Dude, wake up, wake up! Punching yourself in the face, come on.
Pierre (36:50.665)
And then I landed and then it hit me after I landed it hit me like a The doctor came out then I was throwing up and shitting myself and the doctor came and said now you push yourself too hard because the day before we had done like a hundred K's on foot and And I said no, it's definitely not yeah, and I mean, you know something's wrong I discovered Hansa had exactly the same thing. We obviously had a stomach. We had a food poisoning and yeah, and It is for me
Gavin McClurg (37:07.759)
Subverting.
Gavin McClurg (37:12.11)
Ugh.
Pierre (37:19.425)
It took me probably three days to recover and I remember I just I sat in a I found a hut somewhere and we just sat I just I couldn't move I literally couldn't move for about two and a half days and you just watch guys come past you walking past and I just sat there fancy going from like six to seven eight now eventually end up at 21 whatever it was and I managed to hold on to that sort of I couldn't catch up after that so that was probably my best year in terms of I was in the best shape Red Bull shape that
Gavin McClurg (37:44.368)
Mm.
Pierre (37:49.289)
that I had been, you know, and only if I hadn't, yeah. Until I, yeah, that's part of the game, but it was good, it was good.
Gavin McClurg (37:50.878)
Yeah, it was all going pretty good until you ate the rotten whatever it was.
Yeah. That's been a part of Hans's game a couple of times. You know, his is I think 2009 was his no 2007 was his first, but 2009 he was really sick before the start. You know, he was, he was, uh, he was all sick heading up to the, uh, Doc Stein.
Pierre (38:06.125)
Yeah, 2009 was his good one. Yes, yeah.
Pierre (38:16.149)
Yeah, yeah, that's right. He recovered, I think within a day and a half, he was back again, running. It took me like three, two and a half, three days to recover. It was brutal. Anyway, but that was great. And then I decided, okay, let me give it one more go in 2013. And did I do another summit between that? No, I didn't. I then, yeah, I did X-ops again.
Gavin McClurg (38:24.527)
Mm. Ugh.
Ugh, it's the worst.
Pierre (38:43.473)
And in those days we only had one reporter. I think 2013 was the time when you allowed two helpers. The other ones you only allowed one. And Shane they worked like dogs. As you know you've now sort of seen what happens in the background. No it's a huge job. I take my hat off to any seconds. But I see now you allowed like three or four so it's quite a yeah it must be a bit different. But you know really wow okay so yeah.
Gavin McClurg (38:49.335)
Mm.
Gavin McClurg (38:57.67)
Yes. Oh my God, it's a big job. Yeah.
Oh my god.
Gavin McClurg (39:09.03)
You can have as many as you want. Yeah, I know you can have as many as you want. I mean, some of the teams are, you know, four vehicles these days and stuff. It's, it's, it's pretty wild. And it's really interesting, you know, the, the strategy's really interesting. You know, Kregel's never had a big team. Uh, you know, he, he just feels, he always just had Thomas and that was it. And then they had kind of, you know, they had their weather guy back in Switzerland and they, I mean, they had other people on the team, but the actual
Pierre (39:14.242)
Yeah.
Shoof!
Pierre (39:30.258)
Yeah.
Pierre (39:33.754)
Yes.
Gavin McClurg (39:36.198)
on the road team was him and Thomas most for the most part. And then it got to the point, I can't remember when they, when he switched this, I don't know, 2017 or 19 or something where he just thought, okay, it's just now it's so advanced. It's so fast that, you know, he needed somebody else, you know, and so there, I think their team this year was bigger than it had ever been, but it was, it's still compared to some of the others are, is still quite small business. It's just, it's more logistics, isn't it? It's just more to manage more.
Pierre (39:39.077)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Pierre (39:52.242)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Pierre (39:56.53)
Yeah.
Pierre (40:00.286)
Yeah.
It is, yeah. I mean, in 2013, I had the same guy and I could only afford to. I paid for my second each time. So James, again, I couldn't afford another second. I said, well, James, you buy yourself again? So he and he was great. I mean, it's yeah, it is a it is a labor of love.
Gavin McClurg (40:04.618)
more things to go wrong in a sense.
Gavin McClurg (40:22.134)
And you had the same supporter I read in Wikipedia this morning that, you know, the kind of the synopsis of all the races, you had him all three, right?
Pierre (40:31.033)
Yeah, all three. Yeah, just he knew what to do. Because Red Bull, you have to make those little movies and you have to do this and that. And if you don't, you get penalised. So James was very good at doing all that stuff. He was he kept it nice and chuk chuk. And then I just made all the other decisions and he'd try and give me weather when he could. And I was just flailing in the dark. I was never very good at it, but it was good fun. I just enjoyed the adventure. It was a.
Gavin McClurg (40:42.986)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (40:54.406)
Yeah, right. So were your, did you go into each one with a different goal? What was your, what was your kind of hope? What was it? Was it more just, hey, I'm just going for the adventure?
Pierre (41:06.693)
It was basically for the adventure and the first time I did it I said I just didn't want to get eliminated but I did because I had the crash. So that was my first goal. The second time I wanted to try and be in the top 15. The second and third time. I just wanted to be in the top 15. I didn't... I mean it would be lovely to make a goal but I just wasn't in that league of flying. I just didn't have those skills and the knowledge of the Alps that you actually need.
You need to go there for a couple of seasons and actually just learn those valleys backwards. And learn how those valley winds coming from South Africa, those valley winds were just so confusing to me. It just blew my mind. I flew into, yeah, it's... No, no, it is.
Gavin McClurg (41:38.4)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (41:43.574)
Yeah. It's a very, very complicated terrain, isn't it? I mean, I remember Nate has a great story. He showed up in 2007 to do it, and his wife was a supporter, and Ripley, who was two years old, his first daughter was there, and his dad, and Ripley hated his dad because his dad was a chain smoker. It's the funniest story ever. She would call the Red Bull headquarters every day to find out where he was.
Pierre (42:04.774)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (42:10.982)
And he would, he would, he would, he would call. He called her one day and Hey, you know, I'm kind of hungry. Can I get some food? Nate, we're at the pool, you know, just, just so funny back in those days. But he said, when he, when he showed up, uh, Ulrich or somebody, I can't remember who it was, you know, with the organization, you know, basically just said, Hey, you know, you're welcome to the Red Bull X-ops. We're happy to have you here. You're from Idaho. You have no chance in this race.
Pierre (42:11.676)
Oh no!
Pierre (42:18.675)
Hahaha
Gavin McClurg (42:38.762)
You have zero hope because you don't know the Alps. You know, I mean, it was, it wasn't being mean. It was just a fact. Yeah. It's just, it's a.
Pierre (42:39.097)
Hahaha, yeah!
Pierre (42:43.373)
Yeah, yeah.
No, it is a fact. You have to know the Alps. They're right. But it was...
Gavin McClurg (42:49.13)
Yeah, you have to spend a lot of time over there. So 2013, what was, how was, now as I remember, the weather was really good in 2013. Until this year, that was the record for, for Kregel getting in.
Pierre (43:02.577)
It was. I actually managed to fly over 100km on one of the days. So for me, that was, I've actually flown something in the X-Alps now. I didn't have this gradient. It wasn't the best glider they had made that year. But what can you say? But it was. I'm not going to blame it on the glider. I still wasn't a top flyer like everyone else. But yeah, they... I was hoping to again be in the top 15.
Gavin McClurg (43:08.114)
Yeah, look it.
Pierre (43:34.085)
When I stuffed up the first turn point going out to, what is the first turn point then? After Geisberg, they get to Dachstein. No, no, Geisberg and then Dachstein. There I went, we got caught in a bit of rain and the other guys just bombed off down the valley and I decided to land on top. This is the valley before the Dachstein itself. You sort of go over a pass and then you go down.
Gavin McClurg (43:40.342)
Doc Stein? Oh, the guys were.
Gavin McClurg (43:45.599)
Yep.
Gavin McClurg (43:56.158)
Yep, yep.
Pierre (43:59.529)
Continental Valley and then you're on to the lake near and you go up the back and up that via ferrata And I decided to land on top there and wait out the rain For some reason that was a stupid mistake Everyone else just Bolted off and I think they were out of the rain shower within like a K and they carried on flying and I just stuck in This bloody rain cloud for a good couple of hours and then she had to walk off and with a nightmare So I ended up like at the back from that first that first turn point
Gavin McClurg (44:03.626)
Yep.
Gavin McClurg (44:24.174)
Mm.
Pierre (44:30.481)
But I managed to catch up, I think I ended up being 20th if I remember correctly. But yeah, never had... As you said, it was good flying there, the guys just... When it's good flying, they just fly. They just smoked it, yeah. But it was great, yeah. I really enjoyed it. I wish I could go back again, but my knees started getting problems, so I decided no, let's rather... Rather not, and I have actually... I had a subsequent D-Hat in 2000 and...
Gavin McClurg (44:42.35)
Smoked it, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (44:52.562)
Mm.
Pierre (44:58.601)
When was it? 20? Yeah, I had my knees replaced. No, 21. Yeah. And yeah, both knees replaced. I decided to do that before I went to Everest because I decided to go to Everest. I needed a year and a half to recover for my knees. So because I couldn't I got so they got so bad. I was like holding onto a rail trying to walk downstairs. And I thought, wow, this is now getting bad. I need to do something about it when you have to hold on to at the shopping center. You know, you feel like it looked like an eight year old. So I.
Gavin McClurg (45:03.466)
Really? You've got both knees replaced.
Gavin McClurg (45:13.794)
Huh?
Gavin McClurg (45:27.313)
Was that a result of the crash or was that just use and abuse over the years?
Pierre (45:32.289)
use and abuse over the years. I've been running competitively since I was about 10 years old. And obviously, obviously I've had a you hear lots of other people have been running since then and their knees are fine. But obviously, my knees were just always going to go that way for whatever design I am.
Gavin McClurg (45:34.327)
Yeah.
Pierre (45:51.101)
Yeah, but they eventually it was bone on bone and just too sore. So I had to had to take the decision. And I was always very nervous about it. I thought, no, rather just let me take drugs and go and do Everest. But after trying to walk down these stairs, I just thought, no, if I get stuck up there and then I can't walk down, if I can't fly down, you know, I might die on the bloody mountain and because no one's going to carry you off. So, yeah, decision rather just go and get them done. And so that's what I did. And yeah, it's been success. I wish I'd done it earlier. You know.
Gavin McClurg (46:03.178)
Mm.
Gavin McClurg (46:20.554)
Really? So it's fine. My mom's had both of hers done and she's quite a fit gal. She just turned 80 this year, but she's had them both done. First one, about eight years ago, and last one last year. It's just amazing. I mean, it's faster recovery than my, I've had a bunch of, I've had nine knee surgeries, but I...
Pierre (46:21.684)
So, yes, yeah, yeah.
Pierre (46:33.806)
Yeah.
Pierre (46:39.681)
Yes, so the next day or that afternoon after you're up when they wake you up, that's it. They want you walking. I mean it's quite brutal. So yeah, so it's yeah, but your mother's 80. I'm only nearly 60. Well they say, you know, because I wanted to run again and the doctor said no, you know, if you carry on, go back to the running you used to do, you'll run these metal knees out within like five years.
Gavin McClurg (46:45.398)
Yeah, exactly. It's crazy how fast it is. It's unbelievable. Yeah, I mean she was riding her bike in no time again. It was amazing.
Gavin McClurg (46:56.01)
Yeah yeah no you'll be able to use yours.
Gavin McClurg (47:03.81)
They're not built for that.
Pierre (47:09.361)
So, yeah, yeah. So then he just said, just take it up so you can do a couple of 10 Ks a week. And that's it. Don't go and, yeah, you can walk in that, but it's putting the backpack on your back that actually does it exponentially, hammers your knees. And he says, it's probably that from all your training, because I used to load up with 14 kilos and go running to get part of my training for excels. And he says, that's probably what pushed it over the edge. So, yeah, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (47:09.386)
Really?
Gavin McClurg (47:23.346)
Yeah, sure.
Gavin McClurg (47:37.636)
Yeah. It's quite interesting. My first was 2015 and what everybody said was pretty true. Really only Toma ran. You didn't...
It was helpful to be able to run out of Mozart class up to the Geisberg. And there were places where you wanted some speed, but for the most part, you just had to be able to move fast all day and especially go up mountains all fast. You didn't really have to run, but between 15 and my last one, which was 21, and then this year reporting on it and watching the Benoit, and there are a lot of guys that run.
Pierre (48:05.125)
Yeah, I read... Yeah, yeah.
Pierre (48:15.889)
Mm.
Gavin McClurg (48:22.387)
A lot. I mean they're just they're running. Did you? Wow.
Pierre (48:23.409)
Yeah, I ran a lot. I mean, I remember looking at my stats. When Kriegel had finished and I only got like halfway, I've sort of run 700 Ks and flown like 300. And Kriegel's the opposite way around. He's flown the 700 and he's only run like 150 or walked 150. And just, wow, just amazing. But yeah, I did a hell of a lot of running. I remember every time I got down to the valley, I'd be, if it was on a road or a...
Gavin McClurg (48:39.714)
The opposite, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (48:44.666)
Yeah.
Pierre (48:52.829)
decent path, and Switzerland and Europe are good generally. You can run and I just jog along at six and a half minutes a case. Yeah. That's what I'd do. So, yeah. And I think that I really enjoyed it. I mean, I love that supper feast of it. I'm sort of that sort of, my mind's like it. I enjoy the supper. Yeah. So, it's good. Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (49:13.942)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a nice place to be, isn't it, mentally? It's fantastic. There's only one way to get there, and the X-Alps will get you there, for sure. So after 13, where are we in the ticking off the big peaks?
Pierre (49:18.045)
Yeah.
Pierre (49:23.791)
That's true, yeah.
Pierre (49:30.913)
So then we had done, so I'd done Ulbrys, sorry I'd done Akinkagya, I'd done Ulbrys first, then I'd done Akinkagya, then I'd done Kili. And then I decided to go back to Ulbrys with my tandem friend Marianne. So we went back to Russia, had great parties again and climbed the mountain and flew off. And then she videoed it this time because the first time all I had was some happy snaps of me flying. Nothing much, so that was great.
Gavin McClurg (49:51.368)
Great.
Pierre (49:59.349)
So that was successful. And then we went to go into Aconcagua again next for her to just experience that. So I've done Aconcagua three times. But the time, this time when we got on top, like it was a typical act, it just didn't, it was just howling from like five in the morning, it just blew right the way through, sort of at 30, 40 k's an hour. So we just couldn't get off.
Gavin McClurg (50:10.39)
Wow.
Pierre (50:26.989)
and we then went down to our high camp at 6000 and the next day we flew from there down to base camp. So she did get a flight off it. So that was 2014 I think. It was the year, no it was it was December 2012 it was Acomcaga. Because then I did exalts in 2013. And then by then we had started a little company called
my friend Linda and her husband Alistair. And Linda is the mother of Tanzania. She knows she's a tour operator and she does tours and everything to Tanzania and around Africa, wherever you want to go, she can organize it. And we basically decided to do, take paragliding trips of Kilimanjaro and I don't do all of them.
Pierre (51:25.693)
get other guides paragliding people in South Africa. There's Ben Arnold and some other guys that go and do trips for her as well. And she does a couple of trips now. So I'll typically guide maybe two or three trips for her in a year and the other trips, the other guys will guide. So she's got a nice little operation ticking over there. And that was all set up from the very first initial one in 2010. And yeah, she organizes everything.
through it from your whole trip for you and does the permit, the whole works and has got all the contacts for it and runs it very successfully. And she organized for Tom and Horatio now as well on this last trip that we did with them. So that sort of side of that. And then the next mountain we did was Denali.
in 2015. I went and tried that. I wrote to the Parks. I started about a year and a half or two years. I started writing to them saying, will you let me go? This is my name. And I must have written to them three or four times and always just got an answer. Not a chance, not a chance. And then a new Ranger would come there, try him. I spoke to Andy about it and Andy said, no this Ranger, I know him. He's a good guy. He'll actually let you go, I'm sure. But obviously they got their rules there and they...
Gavin McClurg (52:42.354)
Ready?
Pierre (52:53.053)
boss is high up, they have to stick to you and he couldn't. And so it went. So we thought, let's go there, just sneak up and fly off. And when I got there, obviously, because I'd written them, written to them, they knew I was obviously on a list there. Watch out for this guy. He's going to try and come barricade off. As we walked in the door, they just that had a lawyer's letter prepared. You had to sign it. And yeah, yeah. So it was anyway. But it was beautiful. I really, really enjoyed.
Pierre (53:22.573)
Yeah, we did it in, I think, eight days or seven days. It was very quick. And pulled all our own gear up, put it on the sleds and had that whole walk in. And the whole, that was really, I really, really enjoyed it. It was really fantastic. Really out there. I mean, it is an out there mountain. If you aren't doing it with a, you know, with a guided group, we just went. I just took two mates of mine and we went up and we did it. And it was really a great adventure. And for being South African and not
Gavin McClurg (53:23.947)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (53:27.419)
Yeah, well...
Gavin McClurg (53:35.486)
Alaska's amazing.
Pierre (53:51.273)
Big with snow, you know, it was really exciting. Crossing all those crevasses and looking for them and roping up and all that stuff was fantastic. And bloody cold, actually. That mountain was cold, if I remember. It was a cold mountain. Yeah, but getting to that point, getting to that point, I think we must have had minus 25 on some days. It was bloody cold.
Gavin McClurg (53:55.711)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (54:09.206)
They always, I was surprised because you said you were up on top and you were in a t-shirt. You had quite a nice day, but they always talk about that. Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (54:20.702)
Yeah, I mean, everybody always talks about that Denali is, you know, depending on luck and when you do it, it can be often can be the hardest just because it's so cold and so freezing.
Pierre (54:21.331)
Yeah, yeah.
Pierre (54:28.391)
Yeah.
But I remember they told us a big system was coming in. So that and that's why we pushed it to do it. And I think we did it in eight days. We just thought, no, let's just get up this thing before we get court here for like a week. But I remember that, luckily, on summer day, it must have been just before the storm because we then we summited and we then walked out the hallway. We picked up our stuff and we walked right out to where the airstrip is. That was a long day. Wow. Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (54:53.282)
Mmm. Yeah, that's a long day.
Pierre (54:58.033)
Yeah, and then we luckily we they said, OK, that's it. No more flights coming in the next day because the storms coming. And luckily, we persuaded the lady there. Contrary, she was so nice. We just we saw a tourist guy coming past and we said, please radio him. See how many tourists he's got in his plane. And there were two. We said, come land, we'll give you tea and stuff and your tourists can run around the glacier. So the pilot was all keen. He related to them and they said, cool. They landed and then we jumped in the plane and flew out of them. And that's it. And then it was snowed in. I think came in and they couldn't.
Gavin McClurg (55:24.285)
Nice.
Pierre (55:26.889)
do anything for like a week or 10 days. So it was, yeah. It was great fun, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (55:31.874)
The weather's rowdy up there. I mean, you're so close to the ocean that it's just, you know, it's that maritime air and God, it can be so cold, vicious, really vicious place, amazing place though. Yeah.
Pierre (55:41.729)
Yeah, yeah. But I mean, it's a place I definitely want to go back again sometime to actually do some nice, some nice climbing there. There's some beautiful, beautiful climbing routes here. Yeah. And good flying. Yes. Yeah. So. Yeah. Then I looked at doing X-Helps again, but I thought, no, my knees are just, yeah, I'm just going to make them worse. And then some other South African guys tried X-Helps.
Gavin McClurg (55:50.318)
And there's good flying too. Yeah, that's really good flying. Cool, okay, so that's 2015.
Pierre (56:12.129)
I can't remember his name. Kotsa was his surname. I just can't think of his first name now. I should know it anyway. So he did it and then another guy from Cape Town did it in 2018. I think that's the last South African that has tried. Maybe others have actually gone on and just haven't been accepted. I'm not sure.
Gavin McClurg (56:31.275)
Let's start.
Pierre (56:40.925)
I find that's quite disappointing with X-ops that they don't allow more of the outliners. I know it's a race for them and it's also a marketing thing so that's nice to have, but they should try and make it a bit more inclusive in terms of having some more, even though the guys aren't going to win or aren't going to come, they're just the adventure and that spirit with all the other guys, because for them it's even a bigger adventure. I mean it's so out there for...
Gavin McClurg (56:41.162)
Yeah.
Pierre (57:08.433)
if you don't know the Alps. So they should allow I think some more guys from one or two countries in there instead of having like four people from Switzerland or four people from the European countries let a couple more in from outliners.
Gavin McClurg (57:20.158)
Mm-hmm.
Gavin McClurg (57:25.098)
Yeah, I mean, it's a hard thing, isn't it? Cause you've got so much, I mean, the French could have 10 easily, in terms of ability, or all of them, they could all be French. There's so many really good athletes. I've never, they at least have never told me, I have no idea how many people apply for the XL. They've never allowed behind the veil there. I'm sure a lot of the decision is just, is this person gonna...
Pierre (57:31.449)
Yeah, easy, easy. And the Swiss and the, yeah, yeah. All of it, yeah. Yeah.
Pierre (57:45.585)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (57:54.618)
have the ability to not get hurt. I'm sure they're looking at it. It's all fascinating.
Pierre (57:56.71)
Yes, yeah, yeah.
Pierre (58:02.325)
I mean, yeah. And then, yeah, I mean, I must come and do your race, the Red Rocks race, hey? I mean, I've looked at that a couple of times. I'd love to actually come over and do that sometimes, so before I get too old and I can't.
Gavin McClurg (58:09.083)
Yeah, you'd love it, man.
Gavin McClurg (58:14.046)
It's wicked. It's an incredible venue. It's really, really neat. It's spectacular. You know, the fall colors that time of year, it's truly psychedelic. We use that word all the time, but it really is. And it's a pretty neat...
Pierre (58:21.103)
Yep.
Pierre (58:26.63)
Yeah, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (58:30.662)
area. It has none of the accoutrements that the Alps does. There's no hunts, there's no trails, but it works. You can top land and there's launches. It's tangly and messy. It'd be more South Africa. But the terrain is really neat. It's pretty special. The Europeans that have come over and they've had a really good time.
Pierre (58:44.122)
Okay, yeah
Pierre (58:51.365)
Yeah, yeah. Cause I...
Pierre (58:57.109)
Yeah, yeah, because I, you know, I did, I never raced with Nick in the X-Alps because I, yeah, my last one was 2013. Nick then started with you, I think, in 2015. Yeah, because he came over to South Africa. I had a little race called the X-Berg Challenge, which is in the Drakensberg, and it was sort of like a 300 or 400k race down the, down the Escarpment. And I actually...
Gavin McClurg (59:06.983)
Yeah, we both started together.
Gavin McClurg (59:13.971)
Yeah.
Pierre (59:24.929)
I started that for training in 2000. We must have had the first one in 2000 and. No, it was my last race, 2013. So training for that race, I thought, let me just put something together. And I invited like 10 friends. So some of them ran and some of them were on bikes, on mountain bikes. I said, I'll race you from this point to 350 Ks. I think it was 400 Ks down the range. And I invited some other paragliding friends that were into hike and fly. They're not many in South Africa.
than a handful of us that enjoyed. And that's how our little Exberg thing started. And I've started... No, no, I do it now, but informally. I just... It was a labor of love, you know, I'm sure, you know, it's a lot of work to put these things together. And we did it for eight years and then I decided, no, it's just... This is a lot of work. And let me... And when people are paying you, you then got... You know, you're responsible.
Gavin McClurg (01:00:01.386)
It's still going, isn't it? No, no. That's not. No, no. It's finished. Oh, okay. That's because the neighbor of that, you know. Yeah. A lot of work. Oh my God.
Pierre (01:00:22.801)
If someone who you're liable, put it that way. When people start paying for an event in South Africa, anyway, you are liable if something goes wrong badly and you can be seen to have been negligent. So I just thought, no, the risk is just too high. Just now someone is going to kill themselves. And then maybe I have forgotten to tick some box and I'm going to get sued. So I thought, OK, let me just do it for fun now. Yeah, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:00:44.906)
Yeah, that side of it makes me really nervous. Yeah, I remember when Nick was on, I've had him on a couple of times, but he was very complimentary about the expert. He had really good things to say. It sounded amazing.
Pierre (01:00:56.801)
Yeah, I mean, he was amazing. So we I mean, we raced all the way down and Nick just arrived in. We met up a couple of times and Nick, I came across him the one day. I think we stopped at a hotel sort of late evening and we ended up having a burger together and then carrying on and sleeping somewhere in the bush. But he was his feet were sore and Nick was just that's it. I'm just walking barefoot now. And he just like goes feral. He just walks along barefoot on this rough ground.
It was an eye-opener. He really enjoyed it. I mean, he was, yeah. He actually stayed at... He is... He is amazing, isn't he?
Gavin McClurg (01:01:28.594)
Yeah, he's, he really is part animal. He's very comfortable and very uncomfortable situations. You know, he needs the least of any of us. You know, he's, he'll be just fine.
Pierre (01:01:38.069)
Yes, yeah, yeah.
Pierre (01:01:43.634)
And I said, what food have you got? Now, I've just got this little bag of nuts for the whole day. Yeah, yeah, that's it for the whole day. Okay, yeah, yeah. You're such a character.
Gavin McClurg (01:01:47.422)
Yeah, yeah, a little block of cheese. He doesn't need anything. That's amazing. I mean, all of us, we've got these big teams and vans and cookers and all this fancy stuff. And he's got a Subaru and his mom. That's pretty awesome.
Pierre (01:02:01.685)
Yeah. Hahahaha!
Pierre (01:02:06.113)
Ah yeah, amazing. But yeah, you must ask him to tell you one day about his, I don't know if he ever has, about his night out in a herdman's hat. Basically, if you're right on top of their scarf and in Lesotho, you just get these little hats with the odd herdman in it and he got invited into it. But you know, he tells it so well, it's hilarious how funny it is. But yeah, yeah. But he then...
Gavin McClurg (01:02:21.823)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:02:28.814)
I'll have to catch up with them on that. That sounds excellent. So was the next one? Let's go, sorry. Go ahead.
Pierre (01:02:37.265)
Yeah, so then he then went on to, I remember I told him, you must go and do X-Off. Maybe it was really in his mind to go and do it. I said, you're gonna be amazing if you're gonna do that race and you're gonna love it. And the next year or 2015 it was, two years later he went and did it. It was so great seeing him doing it. But yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:02:53.798)
Yeah, he's a big fan favorite for sure all those years. Absolutely. He and I had quite a battle together.
Pierre (01:02:57.421)
Yes, yeah, yeah. No, he stayed, yeah. I've got a little house down there in the Burg and he stayed there, I think, for a month and a half, just flying around and going down rivers. He had that little blow up, flat bottom canoe thing that you, I don't know what they're called, but yeah. So he really enjoyed himself there. It was fantastic. But yeah, so then that was 2015. We did, where was I now?
Gavin McClurg (01:03:15.702)
Yeah, cool, cool.
Pierre (01:03:26.045)
Oh, we had just done Denali, yes. Yeah, yeah. So then we went on, I then had to go and do the next sort of, I was going by expensive. My process of choosing the mountains was the cost of how much it cost to do them, because I put a whole lot of money aside for Everest and Vincent, which, and that was slowly making its own babies and getting better and better. But I then save up for the next sort of cheap mountain. And that...
Gavin McClurg (01:03:26.39)
He just did it all, eh?
Pierre (01:03:54.025)
turn out to be Carstens Pyramid. So of the seven summits, you have a little bit of a, it's either Carstens Pyramid or Kosciuszko, if I pronounce that correctly, in Australia. So Kozi is just a little mound, I think it's 2,200 meters high. You go, ha
Gavin McClurg (01:04:04.026)
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I've been up causey. That's it. You know, there's not much to that. It's a paved road to the top, as I remember.
Pierre (01:04:21.417)
They hadn't done Carstens Pyramid, they had only done Kostiowski. So I thought, okay, I haven't done Denali even though I climbed it, but let me try and do Carstens. I got hold of some guys who had done Carstens. They said, no, you had to go and do it through an agent because there's militia there and they're always fighting and they're fighting with the gold mine there and it's a bit of a thing to actually climb the mountain.
And sometimes you have to get smuggled up through the mine or you have to get helicoptered in if they're fighting because you might get told to ransom if you go through the rainforests which I wanted to do. I wanted to walk up through the rainforest and everything. Anyway so and I...
Gavin McClurg (01:04:58.524)
Where do you start? Is that Port Moresby, or where do you start in Papua New Guinea to do Carson's? Where would be the?
Pierre (01:05:03.633)
So yeah, at the basically the big town there. I've forgotten, yeah, it's got the mining village here as well and everything. All the expats stay there and yeah, yeah. And so we were gonna walk in from there. We got there, we have to hang around a couple of days and the guy was going back and forth and saying, no, there's problems with the insurgents and the other, the guys that wanna blow the mine up and infighting and whatnot. So we...
Gavin McClurg (01:05:07.134)
Okay, more of me.
Gavin McClurg (01:05:13.886)
Yeah, okay.
Pierre (01:05:33.641)
We said, okay, no, let's wait and see if it calms down and then we'll carry on walking. So he said, no problem. And then eventually he comes back and said, no, listen, we're gonna have to chop you in. Maybe he just wanted the money and is bullshitting us. It's gonna be an extra, whatever, 500, $600 each because it's too dangerous to go any other way. So we said, okay, no, no problem. It's a bit disappointing because we're really looking forward to the walk and it's beautiful rainforests here and really amazing, amazing height, looking at the pictures, videos I've seen.
Gavin McClurg (01:05:59.028)
Yeah.
Pierre (01:06:03.429)
Anyway, so we chop it in and that was an eye-opener of notes. We get in there and the guy, another pilot climbs in with him, so there's two of them. We then discover that the pilot that we're going with is now learning. So if we think, okay, you're going to what? You're going to put us down at like 4,300 meters or 4,400 meters. And you, okay, I hope you've learned enough. You know, you've got enough hours under your belt. And...
We packed this thing full and they loaded up. They load this. This is a little, what are those choppers? A little squirrel. Alouette, but it's now the squirrel or whatever it's called now. So it's a powerful little chopper, but they load it up to the max. So on takeoff, this is down at sea level. He goes up and you can hear them talking to each other. And the guy comes and says, it's a little bit heavy. You just put it down and they unload a couple of more tents or chairs, whatever. Pack it up. OK, this should be OK. This is the instructor. OK, let's go.
Gavin McClurg (01:06:58.423)
Mmm. Oh my God.
Pierre (01:07:00.985)
Off we go and we get to, we get and you go up the mine, you're going up these valleys, following the mine road all the way up and eventually the mountains off to your, to the south of you or to the sort of south, southwest or southeast. And I mean, the mine is just it must be one of the biggest mines in the world. It is just huge. But they're just like destroying that mountain, just digging into it and mining. And really horrible to see. But, you know, we get up and we see the mountain. OK, now we have to go up this other little valleys.
Gavin McClurg (01:07:21.954)
Yeah.
Pierre (01:07:29.965)
that leads up from the mine and you start cruising and you see we suddenly see this shore the guy says okay we have to get enough speed so you can make it over the hill and then literally 500 meters after that we land in the valley and he goes over there and they then start speaking in their language and it's getting more and more rapid and more and more
and the guy is obviously trying to crank this helicopter to its max and he just goes over the hill by like a meter. I mean, I was sweating myself. And then he picks up speed going down the other side, thank God. And we had like a... So he had to go sort of fly up to four, I guess it was four seven to get over. And he drops down to back down to about four and a half or four where we landing. And he comes to hover it in and he says, OK, no, then the pilot then comes and speaks English to us and says, OK, no, we can't hover it in guys, we're going to do skid landing here. We're just going to slide it in because
Gavin McClurg (01:08:00.993)
Oh
Pierre (01:08:24.565)
scared we're going to auto-rotate or something and we come in to land or just won't have the air density pressure or whatever to land this thing and so that was a bit of an opener when you're just coming in and sort of and the guy just puts the skids down and just slides in for like you know 10 meters in the chopper and then stops it so that was that was really an eye-opener but really beautiful little mountain and once you're away from the mine and the scenery is unbelievable.
Gavin McClurg (01:08:38.976)
Ugh.
Gavin McClurg (01:08:43.271)
Wow!
Pierre (01:08:54.209)
and not from the very, very top. I think in today's glide, if I'd had like a double skin, not a double skin, the little bantam, we probably would have managed to do it, but you can throw it up. It's just, the rock is so gnarly and so gritty. It just grabs every, it was very steep, but the rock is very sharp. It's like being on the back of a, I don't know what to, it's like faint balls in the cape, but it's rock. And it just grabs everything. It holds your lines, it tears it.
Gavin McClurg (01:08:54.41)
Were you able to take off from the top?
Gavin McClurg (01:09:04.706)
Mm.
Gavin McClurg (01:09:08.799)
Yeah, it's quite steep up there, huh?
Gavin McClurg (01:09:13.801)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:09:20.582)
Yeah.
Pierre (01:09:23.781)
I mean, when we climbed it, we wore leather gloves. That's how rough the rock is, just so you don't cut your hands up. And the leather gloves get shredded just from the... It's a limestone that's from the rain. It's just full of these sharp little sort of inch, inch and a half little spikes everywhere over the rock. It's quite amazing. So we couldn't take off. So we walked back down. They sort of like a... It's about a 1200 meter scramble. And they've put up some little rope.
Gavin McClurg (01:09:27.594)
Wow. Huh.
Gavin McClurg (01:09:41.996)
Huh.
Pierre (01:09:52.773)
the Tyrolean bridges you haul yourself over and whatnot. And we took off, we then walked back, on the way up we then found a place where this would be comfortable to take off here. And there's a little bit of gravel around so the gliders wouldn't get too damaged and the lines wouldn't get caught on. And we took off there. Yeah, so we took off literally about 200, 250 meters below the summit. Yeah.
So that was the first time someone had actually flown off from Papua New Guinea.
Gavin McClurg (01:10:19.397)
And...
Gavin McClurg (01:10:23.13)
I bet. I mean, I've seen pictures of it and stuff. I mean, aren't you totally surrounded by jungle? Where do you land? Do you land back at the mine or?
Pierre (01:10:29.405)
Yeah, you could have. No, we landed back at back at our base camp where the helicopter dropped us just because they just said, please don't fly over the mine. We'll get into trouble. They'll probably try and shoot you down. They had a whole lot of reasons why not. But we could have easier flown all the way back down to the town. Yeah, would have been a beautiful flight. Yeah, yeah, because you could fly to the coast, actually. It's not that far. So, yeah, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:10:34.337)
Ah.
Gavin McClurg (01:10:37.425)
Okay.
Gavin McClurg (01:10:41.763)
Okay, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:10:47.142)
Okay
Gavin McClurg (01:10:51.719)
Oh really? Oh wow. How high is Carstens?
Pierre (01:10:57.541)
is just under 5,000 I think. Yeah, yeah, it's not a small, yeah, it's five castings. I wrote it down here somewhere because I knew you'd asked me. Yeah, 5,000, yeah, just under 5,000, yeah. So, yeah. So they land you at four and a half and then you've got, I think like one and a half thousand meters of actual sort of rocky scrambling to do, yeah. It's quite steep. I think it's about a grade, probably five, nine at one place, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:11:01.15)
Oh, it's big!
Gavin McClurg (01:11:11.882)
Oh wow, okay.
Gavin McClurg (01:11:20.554)
Yeah.
Pierre (01:11:25.989)
So, you know, they've got a rope which you just clip onto and you can sort of self belay yourself. Yeah. So, there you are. No, no, nice little mountain.
Gavin McClurg (01:11:26.031)
Okay.
Gavin McClurg (01:11:30.998)
Huh? Well, cool. Neat. That's more, that's way more of an adventure than Kazi. Sure.
Pierre (01:11:38.045)
Yeah, then we went to Kazi. We then went landed there and took hired a car drove up there and walked up to that little mountain across all the little grids and the things on stilts They've got that winding road. I don't know if you did it there not the road, but they've got the grids on stilts So that you don't work on walk on them on the marsh And damage any of that I guess damage any of the fauna and flora
Pierre (01:12:05.245)
So we climbed up there and then we just flew down the literally like 150 meters. You can't fly much further unless it's a really thermic day.
Gavin McClurg (01:12:12.297)
Right. Yeah, yeah. No, I mean, Australia's got a lot going for it, but mountains aren't really one of them.
Pierre (01:12:17.645)
No, no, you know, and we should have actually gone and flown at, yeah, on the way out or something, but we didn't, we worked with, we set aside two days, two weeks to go fly, climb at, in Tasmania, which is fantastic. Tasmania is a beautiful country, nice little island, wow, yeah, and the fantastic rock climbing there. So we went into that for two weeks and then we went to try and fly off Mount Cook after that. So.
Gavin McClurg (01:12:22.239)
hairs or something.
Gavin McClurg (01:12:33.734)
Yeah...
Gavin McClurg (01:12:39.705)
Mm.
Gavin McClurg (01:12:44.543)
Ah, wicked.
Pierre (01:12:45.725)
Yeah, so I've got a brother who stays in Christchurch, so who lives there. So we went across to him and stayed with him and then popped over and we helicoptered into Mount Cook. And because I discovered Mount Cook, if you look at my website, 7th Summit, 7th Flight, it's 7th Summit, 7th Flight plus one when the website opens and the plus one, my daughter discovered that New Zealand is actually the eighth continent.
Gavin McClurg (01:12:49.546)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:13:11.963)
Ah!
Pierre (01:13:12.741)
It was declared its own continent in 2017. So, yeah, yeah. No, well, we didn't get it. We just, we walked, it was out of condition. So we flew into the camp to the high hut there. And we trapped all the way up and got to the berg's front. And we couldn't cross it, it was just too wide. And the guide, not the guide, but the helicopter pilot had told us, no, it's probably out of condition. You won't get across the.
Gavin McClurg (01:13:16.726)
Whoa, there you go. Good thing you got it. Good thing you ticked it off. Ha ha ha. Ah.
Pierre (01:13:40.533)
the Bergschrank, which is basically the opening between the rock and the where the glacier pulls away from the base of the mountain. And it was like 10 meters wide and sort of you look down, it's like 100 meters, no way you're going to cross this thing. And we couldn't find a way across it. So we just turned and we walked out, which was we should have called for a helicopter come pick us up. But wow, that was a walk out. Very deceptive there in New Zealand, those mountains, beautiful mountains. So I want to go back and fly there. And again, sometime now that I got a brother that lives there.
That's it. Yeah, yeah. So.
Gavin McClurg (01:14:12.331)
Hmm. Yeah, there's some neat flying going on down there. A guy named Benjamin Kellett and, of course, Louie. And there's a bunch of them. They're doing some really cool stuff happening down there in the Southern Alps. Really cool. Very cool. All right. And then I think we're up to Everest now, right? Is that nice?
Pierre (01:14:16.677)
No, Afin and Tom and Ferdy who did that big traverse. And yeah, I mean, wow, no, beautiful, yeah. Yeah. So, yeah.
So.
So yeah, that was, yeah, then it was Everest. And that was really just saving up and saving up. And yeah, I'm glad that money, or waiting for my money that I've put away to grow, which it had. And then I had my operation for my knees, had to recover from that. So I had both knees done at the same time, and which was probably the most painful experience I've ever had when you wake up. And that my dad,
Gavin McClurg (01:14:55.458)
Yeah, that's a tough one.
Pierre (01:14:58.289)
The doctor is a friend of mine, an orthopedic surgeon, Dr. Mark Human. And he said, okay, normally I don't allow any of my patients to have both done at the same time, but I know you and you're a fit guy and I know you can put up with the pain, but he says no amount of morphine is gonna stop this pain. And boy, he wasn't joking when he said that. That was the most excruciating, I think, when I woke up and that pain just hit me. You put...
Gavin McClurg (01:15:22.226)
Really.
Pierre (01:15:28.133)
pump that little morphine bottle as much as you want. It did nothing. I mean, it was probably for a good, I reckon, five hours, six hours, it was the most agonizing pain I've ever gone through, but it was, we survived it, but yeah, there we are. And happy now to be back on my feet, and yeah, then I decided that's it, and I can go and do Everest once I recovered from that. So, and that was an experience and a half, it really was, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:15:29.346)
See you later.
Ugh, vicious.
Gavin McClurg (01:15:42.944)
Ah.
Gavin McClurg (01:15:58.302)
Yeah, I mean, XCMAG did a great article on this, but for those of you listening, check that out. But yeah, so give us the highlights. Did you do it with the gal that was doing the photography and stuff, too, or no? You said that was too expensive.
Pierre (01:15:58.491)
and uh...
Pierre (01:16:07.837)
So again, it's...
Pierre (01:16:13.365)
No, no, yeah, so I just went by myself and I took an Insta360 and basically filmed it like that and yeah, so I've got hundreds of hours of walking up Everest and all the stuff that goes with Everest and the flight down and so I still have to do something with that. I'll just put a friend of mine put a little clip together but that's sort of on YouTube and yeah. But Everest itself was, it's been a dream of mine to climb it from ever since I...
was climbing since a teenager. So that was already a dream of mine coming true. And then since I could paraglide, why not fly off it? And you look back in the history of, just the history of Everest itself is just, yeah, it's just one of those iconic mountains. If you put aside all the other stuff that goes with Everest and all the, you know, the nonsense about it these days and all the politics and the...
I don't know who they are. The people that shouldn't be climbing it, that do climb it, and get hauled up Everest and all that, all the drama that goes with it and the politics, put that aside, it is an amazing, iconic mountain. It really is. It's got a lot of history to it. And flying history as well, actually. Marc, our butcher is Bovin, or however you say the French name. I should know how to do that because my mother's French.
Gavin McClurg (01:17:19.346)
Yeah, yeah, sure.
Pierre (01:17:41.705)
So he flew off in 1988. And then, yeah. And he landed, you know, the gliders, I think it was actually 1987 when he flew off it. And he took off from just below the summit and only made camp one just above the icefall. That was his glide angle. But he managed to get out of the glider. Just like a one in, jeez, less than a, like a one in a, one in a half, no, one in a half or something. I don't know, it was like, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:17:44.571)
Ah! How do you know that?
Gavin McClurg (01:18:03.114)
Jeez.
Gavin McClurg (01:18:10.926)
God.
Pierre (01:18:13.233)
like a 70 degree slant angle, boom, straight down. Yeah, yeah. A wingsuit would have got further. And then there was, I guess I've flown off it, but like from a much lower off on the mountain from sort of 6,000 meters here and 5,000 meters here. But all of it was illegal. And I...
Gavin McClurg (01:18:15.86)
Basically in a parachute. He was parachuting down.
Gavin McClurg (01:18:22.162)
Yeah, right. Way further.
Pierre (01:18:41.293)
had this little goal to do it legally. And I asked various people to try and eventually someone, actually an ex-ops pilot put me onto Asian trekking, Dower Stephen Sherpa, who runs that company. And it's, I think it's the oldest Everest company. It's been running for 45 years. His father started it. And...
Dallas Stephen took it over and they're a well connected family in terms of being there for so long and they're well connected in Nepal. And he started skydiving Everest where they take you up at base camp and you can jump out of a helicopter at 6,000 meters and land back at base camp. So he started that little thing as well. So I thought this is definitely the guy to speak to. He's got the contacts. He's got skydiving approved there. You know, he just has to get us flying off the mountain. So he went knocking around on doors for me and came back with a no. So.
Gavin McClurg (01:19:31.522)
Mm.
Pierre (01:19:39.265)
This is like a year before the trip. And then he came back six months later and said, I'm booking with you now anyway, and if I have to, I'm going to do it illegally. So I told him that. He hummed and aahed and argued with me. And I said, well, yeah, let's carry on knocking on the door. And he carried on doing that. And luckily for us, one of the ministers actually changed, portfolios changed, and they got a new guy in. And they had just been through COVID.
and their numbers were down with tourists. So Dawa went to him, Dawa approached him and said, listen, let's give this to this chap. It's going to increase a lot of, give us a lot of exposure if he manages to fly off. And there's a lot of pilots out there that might want to come and do this. We never know, it might take traction. And so the day before, actually it's my summit day. So you go there and you're climatized for like a month and a half.
Gavin McClurg (01:20:10.414)
Mmm.
Pierre (01:20:38.353)
And then you wait for the window and the opportunity to climb Everest because you have to wait for the right for the jet stream to lift and move out the way. So you can actually climb it without getting killed. And obviously, for flying, you don't want the jet stream around. And literally the day before the night, he came to me and said, Yeah, good news. They have just emailed me your permit. And I was like, thank fuck for that, because I was going to.
Gavin McClurg (01:20:59.982)
Wow.
Pierre (01:21:04.825)
He said, you know, we are always talking in base camp. I told you, you can't do it legally. I'm going to get fined. You're going to get fined. Please don't. It's not worth it. And paragliding will never be allowed again. And, you know, but the permit came through and now it's opened the whole region up. You know, Jirai Kurin, who is there now, a friend of mine, I don't know if you know Jirai from, he's been in Cross Country magazine a couple of times. I think he's done excels once. He went there flying and he was flying around that area. So they now opened it up and you can actually just.
Gavin McClurg (01:21:27.142)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, you did the exercise.
Pierre (01:21:34.653)
go pay your little permit and go fly there. It is very busy. I wouldn't, in terms of helicopters and that, it is a busy valley. I mean, it is helicopters nonstop going up and down. So I would take an air band radio and try and communicate with them because generally the helicopters are in the middle of the valley and we'd be on the side of the mountain. So we should be pretty safe. Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:21:38.397)
Oh wow, we can...
Gavin McClurg (01:21:55.558)
Yeah. How did Babu do it then? Did they have a permit or was that illegal? Oh, I didn't know that.
Pierre (01:22:00.633)
No, they did it illegally and just because he's Nepalese and that, they turned a blind eye and gave him a slap on the wrist. And yeah, so he got away with it. But I must say his tour operator wasn't very impressed because he went on as a as helping the cook, as sort of a helper. And then him and the cook just went up the mountain and popped off. Yeah, yeah, they got, yeah, they weren't very, very happy with Babu. But.
Gavin McClurg (01:22:05.826)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:22:16.564)
Right.
Gavin McClurg (01:22:22.312)
Re... Oh, I didn't know that background.
Pierre (01:22:29.009)
I think in retrospect, not everyone laughs about it. But it was an amazing adventure what he did. I mean, wow, taking off, flying all the way down and then jumping in a canoe and wow, no, it's amazing what he did. It's really amazing. Yeah, yeah. So Babu was part of me getting my permit as well, actually. He, the Minister of Tourism, then said, well, we want you to be signed off that you can actually fly, that you are a paraglider pilot, that you are able to fly off Everest.
Gavin McClurg (01:22:39.734)
All the way to the sea, yeah, that was a good mission for sure. Well, what were the...
Pierre (01:22:59.101)
and we would like Babu because Babu is the Nepalese guy who flew off Everest last. We want him to approve you. So I thought oh well that should be okay. I walked, I know Babu, I met him at Exile. So we walked together for a whole day in 2013. So I just sent him a mail saying Babu please, when you get this from the minister, sign me off. And he said no problem. Yeah so I was lucky in that sort of sense.
Gavin McClurg (01:23:24.137)
Mm.
Pierre (01:23:24.201)
that happened and that Babu managed also. I guess Dawah Stephen and Babu were maybe putting a bit of pressure on the minister and it worked out for me. And yeah, so yeah, yeah. Anyway, but yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:23:32.075)
That was...
Gavin McClurg (01:23:35.926)
Babu is such a good soul. I can't remember which one he competed in. It was one of the ones I did. I don't know if it was 2015 or 2017, but he had done Everest. That had happened. And then he showed up at the Red Bull Ex-Obs. I might have this slightly wrong, but he gave a presentation for that club in Geneva. And I was there, I was giving a presentation on some film that I had done. I can't remember which one that was either. But then afterwards he came up to me and said, I would really like to...
Pierre (01:23:46.075)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:24:04.514)
Can you tell me about this thing I keep hearing about called the Vario?" And I went, what? And he said, he said, Yeah, I would like to compete in the Red Bull X-Ops with the Vario. Can you tell me how it works? And I, are you fucking kidding me, Babu? Seriously? I mean, it was just, I just gave a big hug. Man, I'm so glad there are people like you still out there in the world. You know, you've flown off Everest, but you haven't flown with a Vario. That is awesome.
Pierre (01:24:09.14)
Yeah.
Pierre (01:24:34.387)
Yeah.
No, he was an amazing character. I mean, when I was with him, he had very broken English, but it was great. We still managed to communicate. And I see he's got a very nice setup where he is now. So, yeah, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:24:45.687)
He's always smiling.
I've heard. Yeah, I've heard it's amazing. I've heard it's amazing. Well, so what were the what were the unique memories from the you know, how was it get you flew off the top in you?
Pierre (01:25:02.117)
No, they didn't. So my permit only allowed me to fly from 8,000 meters. And yeah, they wouldn't let me go from the top for whatever reason. You know, the permits to fly off, besides the climbing permit, the flying permit, they came to an agreement. Actually, there was an Australian guy they're also trying to fly off at the same time as me. I've forgotten his name now. I should have written it down. And he, so both of us were applying and Dawar Steven was the guy who was applying for both of us.
Pierre (01:25:32.897)
And he agreed before I got there, before I got to Nepal, he was there like a week earlier. He had gone and sat down, even though the minister hadn't agreed to giving us a permit yet, he had negotiated a $5,000 permit fee to fly off. Which was a bit of a shock to me, I suddenly had to fork out $5,000, which was not good for our bank account. But anyway, it was to fly off. So.
Gavin McClurg (01:25:48.116)
Mm.
Gavin McClurg (01:25:57.236)
Yeah.
Pierre (01:26:01.201)
Ken, it was Ken, that was his name. I said, thanks Ken for that, but maybe that's, I wasn't in those negotiations and Ken came to that, but I wish he had stuck to like $1,000 or $500. But anyway, it was, so anyone now that goes to go and try and fly for Everest, they're gonna have to fork out a $5,000. And Ken sort of said, that's it, no more. And maybe if he had gone and said, maybe 8,000 for the top, they would have said, yes, go to the top. I don't know if it was a money thing.
Gavin McClurg (01:26:11.182)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:26:20.958)
Hmm, that's kind of the precedent now.
Pierre (01:26:31.009)
or if it was, they never told us, or if it was just a political thing because the summit is shared with China, they didn't want to have any fallout with China with someone flying off the top. You know, I'm not sure. So they just said, no, 8,000, that's it. Please don't go above that. So that's basically the South Cole. And that was, yeah, when I got there, I never went to the top. I'd love to go to the top of Everest, but I had to make a decision because of the weather that was changing.
Gavin McClurg (01:26:40.974)
Sure.
Pierre (01:27:00.229)
So and to go back and climb Everest and pay that fee again, which in South African terms is a lot of money. It's yeah, I think it's going to cost you, you know, 60, 70 thousand dollars, yeah. The cheapest sort of trip. So it's yeah. So to pay that sort of money again to go and climb just to the top of the mountain. I don't know if I really want to from that keen. I'd rather go and do another 8,000 meter peak.
Gavin McClurg (01:27:15.048)
Wow! Jeez!
Gavin McClurg (01:27:25.816)
Yeah.
Pierre (01:27:26.749)
you know, that like joy or one of those, which I probably am going to do sometime. And they cost a 10th of the price of Everest. So, yeah, yeah. But yeah, so it was, you know, when I got up there, it was the decision to, the weather was coming in and it's amazing the guys, they get the weather from, from guys in Switzerland and someone from actually in the States that gives the weather as well. And that the accurate down to the, almost like the hour, it's amazing.
Gavin McClurg (01:27:34.018)
Sure, yeah, sure.
Gavin McClurg (01:27:55.733)
Wow.
Pierre (01:27:56.009)
how they can predict it that well. I woke up and the guys just said, listen, my summit day, they just said, it's gonna be snowing by 12, between 12 and two o'clock, it's gonna be a whiteout on top, you won't be able to take off from the South Summit upwards. Basically from seven, I think they said, from seven and a half thousand meters upwards, it's gonna be snowing. And so then you sit there and you're discussing with your Sherpa.
Gavin McClurg (01:27:58.522)
Oh.
Pierre (01:28:23.057)
If you're fit, if you're really fit, can you make it back down here by 10 in the morning? And you're leaving the summit day, it's only like 800 meters or 700 meters that you have to go. No, it's 850 odd meters. And so it's not very high if you think about it, if you're sea level or at 2000 meters and the Alps, that's quick. But up there, it takes you, the fit guy will go leave at like nine in the evening and only be back down at about 11, 12.
Gavin McClurg (01:28:44.162)
but there.
Pierre (01:28:52.545)
next day. So it's like a 15 hour to 18 hour day and I'd been sick, quite sick at Camp 2 on my way up and I had stayed for four days, I hadn't eaten for three and I'd vomited myself to like seven kilos lighter and so I wasn't in the strongest and best shape.
Gavin McClurg (01:28:53.742)
Wow. Easy.
Gavin McClurg (01:29:00.707)
Yeah.
Pierre (01:29:19.925)
When I got up there, I just said, I took it off to that. I just took it camp by camp. If I get to camp three, fantastic. If I'm feeling sick at camp three, I'm gonna bail and fly down from there. If I get to the South Coal, that's fantastic. You know, I went to go to the South Coal, and I was feeling okay. And I said, okay, maybe I can go for the summit. But then they told me this weather prediction, and I thought, okay, I'm gonna have to make a decision, and I'm not that fit, so I'm not gonna make it up and down by 12 o'clock. And my teammates who went, they only made it down.
quickest I think was around about three o'clock. So he came down in the whiteout in the snow and the slowest which maybe would have been me because I wasn't in the best of shape came down at like six that evening. So I decided no stuff is I'm here to fly off it. Let me fly off and the summit I can always tag another time if I make a lot of money along the way I can go back and tag it another time. So yeah we got up at six and checked and there were clouds in the valley and
Gavin McClurg (01:29:51.986)
Wow. Mmm.
Gavin McClurg (01:30:01.35)
Wow, so they went right through the storm.
Gavin McClurg (01:30:12.398)
Mm.
Pierre (01:30:19.893)
Couldn't see landing, it was just a whiteout as far as you could see. At sort of 5,000, 6,000 meters the clouds had just banked up. So I went back, had tea, had tea, got up, checked at 10, then the wind had picked up and it was howling like 60 kms an hour. But the clouds had broken up, so at least something was happening. Basically the whole air mass was now coming up, up the valley and up to our altitude.
you're looking at, you know, you've got 5 000 meters and you've got 67 and then you've got 7 to 8. You've got these different sort of altitudes as you go up and the weather patterns seem to differ between altitudes. It's quite amazing. And then we're having more tea. That's all you do up there is drink tea and my Sherpa was having his 100th cigarette and it's amazing those guys. They go the whole way up just puffing away. They are so strong. It's unbelievable.
Gavin McClurg (01:30:52.526)
And.
Gavin McClurg (01:31:13.725)
Wow.
Pierre (01:31:15.969)
Anyway, so we are having our hundreds cup of tea as well. And suddenly the tent just, it's not actually shaking as much as it was like an hour and a half ago. I said, okay, this is getting promising. Let me go and have a look. So zip everything on and climb out and walk to the edge. And the wind was feeling, this is maybe take off a bullet. It's like feels 35 to 40 Ks an hour. That's what it feels like. And you think, yeah, at home, if I take off, I'm gonna be...
have to go on speed bar straight away and maybe I'll be able to edge forward and get out of the compression here. But okay, that's looking promising. Walk a bit further. Okay, the clouds have opened up. There's gaps in the clouds. Okay, I think I can do this. So, went back to the tent, started kitting up. My Sherpa came out. We called some other Sherpas from other teams because they tried the glider. The glider was just blowing all over the place. And it was one of those light weight gliders.
Gavin McClurg (01:32:03.622)
I'm not sure if I should change my phone or not. I don't know if I should. I'd advise it, I don't know if it's label or not. But, you know, I'm not sure if it's a good phone or not. But if it's a hold it down, please. I'm not sure if I should. The good is that it's a feeling phone, but I'm thinking, yeah, that would be a good phone. I'm not sure if I should.
Pierre (01:32:13.441)
wind explodes them like a rag. So I got them to hold it down for me and I thought hell, when I pull this thing up I'm gonna get... this wind is feeling strong but I'm gonna get yanked backwards before I get it under control. Anyway so I pull it up, tell the guys to leave it, pull it up and nothing happens. It like pops up, I have to control it a little bit, it's a bit faster than usual. That was at 8 000 meters of things now reacting a bit like a sort of
Gavin McClurg (01:32:33.806)
But again, I hope that the problem is that
Pierre (01:32:43.625)
and this is like an A-glider we're talking about. So it's okay, this is doable, but it's not lifting me, it's not dragging me. And then I have to start bloody running to get this thing to fly. I think I must have the longest sprint, well, I felt like a sprint on Everest as well. Must go down on the record books. I had to like run 20 or 30 meters to get the glider to fly. And you're running there and I was so out of breath. It was unbelievable. I thought I was going to pass out. Even though I had oxygen on me.
Gavin McClurg (01:33:05.374)
Crazy.
Pierre (01:33:13.633)
It was, and I took off, gave a yell and then I'd sat and I panted. I thought I was going to pass out. I just kind of like hung there sort of in a delirious state. And slowly the oxygen, I actually took my mask off because I thought I could breathe. I just couldn't get oxygen. You get that feeling where you can't breathe. You just can't get enough oxygen. And eventually I thought, OK, that's stupid. Put the mask back on. That's where the oxygen is. And sort of suck a big breath and eventually.
Gavin McClurg (01:33:31.738)
Yeah.
Pierre (01:33:41.173)
I sort of flew out and we're discussing with the helicopter pilots. I'll stay on the right hand side of the valley all the way down and do the dog leg. And I've chosen a spot to land down at Gorka ship, which is only grass, because I didn't want to land in the rocks and at base camp or the ice. Just in case I came in too fast, because it's five and a half thousand meters you're landing at. And in the video, you can just hear me breathing. I'm feeling like a run.
Gavin McClurg (01:33:55.487)
Yeah.
Pierre (01:34:09.085)
sprinted a thousand meters as quick as I could, the whole way down, the whole way down. It was just this, ah, the whole way. Anyway, but it was, yeah. And it was totally surreal. It was unbelievable. I mean, that flight was just, yeah. Even though I only took over 8,000 meters, if I'd actually got my breath or maybe, I don't know how you would have, maybe if I'd had a bigger glider and maybe a more high-performance glider, I think I could have actually caught something and gone to the top, rid-sawed up to the top.
Gavin McClurg (01:34:20.609)
Oh
Pierre (01:34:38.437)
I really do. I was just in such a buggered state. I just didn't, you know, I just couldn't do anything else. I was just so broken from that run. And someone is going to do it. Someone's going to go and take off from there. If you take up a nice sea glider or a D wing and a little bit bigger than your normal size. You'll actually I think I'm sure you could actually take off from Gorka ship and fly to the top of Everest. So someone's definitely going to do that as well. Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:34:38.934)
Wow, crazy.
Gavin McClurg (01:34:45.629)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:34:57.954)
Something has a little bit of performance.
Pierre (01:35:09.757)
So, because I went through a big thermal, I went through a thermal, I look at my track log, I went through a two and a half meter second thermal for about a good 20, 30 meters and I didn't even register, I was so buggered. But yeah, I could have actually taken that up and the clouds were going up the side. Yeah, I think I could have red short up the top. Anyway, that's, but yeah, it was really a surreal experience and just flying through those clouds and you're flying up at base camp and you still.
Gavin McClurg (01:35:10.448)
Wow, amazing.
Gavin McClurg (01:35:29.13)
Wow, wow, cool.
Pierre (01:35:38.397)
7000 meters going over base camp you higher than Paul Maury, you know, it's just unbelievable now so yeah
Gavin McClurg (01:35:44.93)
It must be something so gratifying about, I mean, all these years and money and time invested and everything and just, and then having the experience. It's gotta be.
Pierre (01:35:57.433)
It was. I think it was, you know, from the flying, if you look at it just purely flying, and I forget about the scenery, is that it wasn't, you know, it was a flight of foot feet down basically of just over 20 minutes. So from that point of view, it wasn't, you know, but just flying off Everest and just that experience and flying through that history of it, it was just so, ah, it was just unbelievable. I mean, it brought me to tears when I was landing. I was just, yeah, I was overwhelmed. So it really was very, very special.
Gavin McClurg (01:36:25.614)
I'm sure you were. Yeah. And also be able to breathe again. Must have been nice.
Pierre (01:36:27.893)
Yeah, and it was a nice one to have ticked off now and it's done and Yeah, yeah, that was that was it was nice to get into the warm air from like minus I think it was minus 15. It wasn't that cold on top. But uh, Yeah It was uh, and luckily dower steven had the sense to send a sherpa because I hadn't actually planned I knew I was landing but I hadn't I didn't have any kit to You know, I had my I had my long johns and then my downed evera suit over that
Gavin McClurg (01:36:41.246)
Yeah. Wow. Amazing.
Pierre (01:36:55.849)
So to walk back, and now you're in like 10, 15 degrees. So luckily he had the sense to send one of the porters down with some tachies and shorts and a shirt. So I could walk back. I sort of landed eight k's away from base camp. So yeah. Yeah, no, it was fantastic.
Gavin McClurg (01:37:14.722)
Right, right. Wow, cool. And so that leaves Vincent. Do you have a timeline on that? Or you said that's the most expensive.
Pierre (01:37:23.106)
Yeah, so that is another, that's going to be, so this Everest one, I did Asian trekking, are one of the cheapest ways you can do it and that cost me $50,000. It was actually $45,000 I think. So Vincent now, I've been looking around and you have to go through, I don't think you can actually do it by yourself, I'm just researching a bit more, but I want to do it now in December, January coming up.
and just looking at the cheapest there is going to be around about 50,000 I think around about 60,000 dollars so it's not cheap either yeah but it sounds like a big adventure so I'm probably going to go and do
Gavin McClurg (01:37:52.034)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:38:02.571)
Plenty of building and tandems in your future.
Pierre (01:38:08.419)
No, no, I've got the money actually, luckily enough. So I've put the money away so it's there. I must just now book it and with the right company. And I'll probably go and do an Acme Caigua trip, maybe guide one up in December. Then I'll be acclimatized and then go down and do it. And it's like a 10, 11 day trip. It's not a long trip. Yeah. But yeah, it's an exciting trip. And yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:38:09.387)
I'm out.
Gavin McClurg (01:38:14.06)
Nice.
Forget and make it happen.
Gavin McClurg (01:38:27.603)
Mm. Smart.
Gavin McClurg (01:38:33.826)
Well, Pierre, well, yeah, that's also like Alaska, a very neat part of the world. We'll have to bring you back to the show for the postpartum on that one and see how it went. We'll have to get you back to talk about that. But Pierre, thanks for sharing all these amazing stories, man. You're hurting my face. I've been smiling for an hour and a half.
Pierre (01:38:36.294)
Yeah.
Pierre (01:38:41.754)
It is, yeah, I know, it's gonna be beautiful down there.
Pierre (01:38:48.373)
Yeah, yeah.
Pierre (01:38:56.069)
Yeah, I haven't. I don't even know what the time is. The time is... I don't know. Well, but yeah. But hopefully if I do that then we would have done the seven summits except for Denali. So yeah, that would be a... Yeah, yeah. So I'm looking forward to it.
Gavin McClurg (01:39:08.948)
Yeah.
Well, hopefully that gives me some motivation to keep lobbying over here to try to get this ridiculous rule removed. I don't know if that'll happen in our lifetimes, but the change is slow when it comes to government. But it'd be nice to get rid of that. But thanks for all the stories, man. I really appreciate it. I'm glad we were finally able to connect here. Thank you, man. That was fun.
Pierre (01:39:18.395)
Yeah, yeah.
Pierre (01:39:27.753)
Yeah.
Pierre (01:39:31.705)
Yes, hopefully we see you soon, hopefully I'll come and do Red Rocks sometime. But yeah, do you want to come over to South Africa or Africa? Give me a shout. Look me up, we can put you up this side. No problem.
Gavin McClurg (01:39:36.822)
I'd love to. That'd be great. We will take care of you in style. We have some, yeah, we've got the American hospitality here to show you. So just let me know. We'll take care of you. That'd be a lot of fun. You'd love it. Cool, bud. Nice talking to you, bud. Cheers. Thanks.
Pierre (01:39:49.273)
Yeah, cool man. Yeah, looking forward to it. Good. Okay. Thanks a lot, Kevin. Cool. Ciao.
